There's Ray! Plus: Plenty of Room For More Brains at Microsoft.
Hey, There's Ray! Commentary on Ray Ozzie's recent Goldman Sachs Technology Investment Symposium appearance (transcript, webcast) :
- Reading the Ray Ozzie tea leaves by Mary Jo Foley collects some Ozzie-isms that caught Ms. Foley's attention.
- Mr. Joe Wilcox does a nice technical dive into the Ozzie-arena:
- Mr. Todd Bishop at the Seattle-PI:
- MSFTextrememakeover Limbo, limbo, like kimbo - includes commentary on Mr. Ozzie.
Overall, the reaction seems to be: "Meh." For whatever reason, I feel there's an increasing expectation for Ray to walk onto the stage with a TabletPC cradled in each arm blazing innovative thoughts for the future that leave the audience agog. Now everyone is looking towards Mix07 for the "Wow" because this last presentation came up short.
I hope that we manage to make this a wave of shipped innovation with a squad of technical leaders - not just Mr. Ozzie - delivering connected service after service that both acknowledge the need for an open, non-insular connected existence and that heavily leverages the power of a rich-client environment running under Windows. Right now, one shinning example of this to me is Windows Live Writer. I love that little bugger. And it's not just tightly coupled with Spaces but rather plays well with others.
Where's Blake? There goes Blake Irving, another Corporate VP:
- Microsoft Windows Live VP to resign - All about Microsoft ZDNet.com Mary Jo Foley broke the story of Blake Irving resigning from Windows Live Platform.
- Report: Windows Live exec plans to leave Microsoft - Mr. Bishop follows-up and tries to get a quote from Mr. Irving.
Ouch! Snap! Some recent Vista / Office 2007 unluvin':
(1) SpendMatters Vista, Office and Outlook 2007 are a Nightmare: specifically, the same problems I've having as well with Outlook 2007 being mega slow:
The problem -- which is absolutely inexcusable -- is that Office 2007 (Outlook, specifically) crawls, even on this superfast machine. The hard-drive is also constantly in motion, slowing things down even more. I'm not alone in these observations. You can read other Office 2007 horror stories here and here. Despite a small .PST file -- I reduced mine from close to a gig to less than 150 MB -- my Intel Centrino Duo-driven notebook chugs along like a 386 trying to run an application originally written for a mainframe system. Even such tasks as composing a simple email are delayed by a few seconds before my typed words ultimately appear on the screen (and send / receives and related activities take an eternity).
(2) Windows Vista I’m Breaking up with You ~ Chris Pirillo - Movie Maker crashes, LifeCam no-workie, no device drivers, software incompatibilities, and more and more woes. Best quote: "The Whoa starts now."
What I tell everyone: just buy a new machine to run Vista on. Unless you're a fan of flagellation (and relieving the sting of via blogging), don't upgrade an old machine that's collected precious application cargo and devices. Goodness forbid you have an unsupported Creative sound-card, for instance. Mr. Pirillo got a load of comments on this one and follows up with Where Windows Pundits Went Wrong and Switching from XP to Vista to XP to… (where he affirms the cool things that Microsoft makes. Just not Vista.).
Post Stack-Ranked Future First Step: something that I think would be a significant first step from unhealthy peer vs. peer performance ranking: Team Compensation for Performance. I was talking with a friend who used to work at big hardware manufacturer. He said their main bonus budget and dispersion was directly attached to the goals their team's leadership put together to deliver for the upcoming year and how well they did on those goals. Regular updates through the quarter were shared with the employees. The goals were S.M.A.R.T. and aggressive and directly tied to business results.
The better the whole team performed on delivering those results, the better all of their bonus was. Stock and raises were used for distinguishing individual performance.
Brains! Now I'm really scared. First I was pissed-off and horrified at how much and how quickly Microsoft's number of employees grew for no obvious business need. Now, hearing about the contents in the latest InsideMS post by Chris Owens, we're not only expanding our building construction and acquisition in the Redmond area quickly to deal with the stuffed-sardine situation most groups have but we're also... hold on, I've got to steady myself... we're also planning to accommodate another... deep breath... 10,000 to 12,000 Redmond-area hires.
(Insert your favorite sound effect of my head exploding.)
Why?
Is your group lacking talent to execute? What have we done to rebalance and recruit internally? We're already staggering to operate effectively with our current mass of employees, how in the world do we expect to be effective with even more? And if Redmond grows by 12,000 people, how much of that will be matched with global hiring?
And Redmond certainly doesn't need another 12,000 Microsoft drivers bumper-to-bumpering the local streets.
Let's take a hiring breather first and do some quality internal recruiting. I would then usually insert a pithy, "...and then you know, fire a bunch of underperformers" remark here, but right now I'm singularly interested in holding the line.
Comment round-up: some comments that caught my eye over the past week:
(1) Been a few places since I left MS. Landed at a startup with a whole lot of older former MS folks. They're all good, know what they're doing, and have lots of experience. Makes it a real fun place to work. Keep whacking the Kim's over there - they make great hires.
(2) Dr. Seuss meets Mini-Microsoft commenters (the beginning - navigate for the rest):
Oh the places you'll go! Oh the things that you'll do! You'll work your ass off To be ranked Limited II! You'll listen to morons Who know not what they do! [...]
(3) Manager feedback is closed, but something to think about regarding honest feedback: Right now, my career in this divison is basically over - I'm given conflicting feedback on career progress and progress against commitments. I'm at a level where the jobs are few and far in between so I'm just laying low and waiting for something else come along because I need the paycheck.
(4) Regarding Career Compass and HR career management fatigue: I almost wish there was a checkbox on the benefits website where I could opt-out of receiving stock options & bonuses as long as I didn't have to waste time with reviews and whatever other ridiculous paperwork HR forces on software engineers each year.
(5) Some folks are receiving an HR survey about the compensation system. One comment on that from someone filling out the survey: I came out very well last review but to put it bluntly, I had to manage up, manipulate, etc to get my reward. I delivered great results (E) but this is Microsoft, everybody delivers results. How do you stand out? So I did what I had to do and I know it came at the expense of other Es - I know this for a fact
I wish I did not have to do this and since I was able to manipulate the process, the process is flawed.
I could keep quiet about this and say the process works but I do want to make this place better. Somedays I don't think it will never get better but hope springs eternal.
I was very honest in that survey and the results on the 1st page was UGLY for us as a company.
176 comments:
"we're also planning to accommodate another... deep breath... 10,000 to 12,000 Redmond-area hires."
Well, you at least have to admire Ballmer's decision to go out in a spectacular ball of flames vs just a slow burn out. :-) Totally agree btw - that's just insane. How many of those people will actually be involved in coding or otherwise shipping product? 1 in 10? 20? 50? Headcount growth post-00 has already been totally out of control. MSFT should freeze US employee growth completely except for strategic initiatives (at least wrt Redmond), and any incremental headcount should only occur where sales growth is also forecast to ramp (i.e. primarily emerging markets).
"I hope that we manage to make this a wave of shipped innovation with a squad of technical leaders - not just Mr. Ozzie - delivering connected service after service that both acknowledge the need for an open, non-insular connected existence and that heavily leverages the power of a rich-client environment running under Windows."
And, here's how that should work. Mini-version on cloud AND desktop (where there is no WI-FI). File on cloud AND desktop (for same reason + backup + collaborate) and program keeps track of versioning.
Rich stuff on cloud OR desktop with subscription on cloud and paid in full version on desktop.
Cool huh? More thoughts?
Mix is a fucking joke. Come on now, how hard is it to use a proper format for that header on http://visitmix.com/. Color scheme is retarded. Look at all those JPEG compression artifacts - no self respecting designer would be caught dead with garbage like this. And that's exactly the audience they should be shooting for.
My hat is off to the individual who said that "kims make great hires" because, yes, we do. We learned a lot at Microsoft and gave back more than we got and stayed well past the point of no return because we believed the concept that merit wins out of mediocracy and that there are remedies for bad managers and alternatives to bad groups. I took a highly prized graduate degree with me because the head of my group told me it was worthless to him. Now who is responsible for the disconnect between him and his direct report, my manager, who signed all of those tuition reimbursement vouchers? So for every hard working "Kim" that finally gets it and walks out, they have to hire two or three others to do the same level of work. Because, sure as the day is long, the unwatered plants on my former team are not going to step up, think out of the box, give a little extra, or whatever one does to warrant staying in the job let alone thriving at it. And why should they? They are the smart ones after all. Why work harder when they've found a comfortable cubbyhole to wait out until they have enough to retire. After all, they are getting yearly raises, stock grants, and bonues for just that. Me? I'd rather be where I am now, doing good work, getting better at it, thinking about things that are going to make a difference and actually getting to execute on them because there is no interference from those folks ostensibly on my team. And, I never have to worry about going back to Microsoft, no matter what I do, accomplish, or achieve. Because I am a "Kim" and HR would not touch me with a barge pole. Oddly enough, I'm sleeping better at night.
Come on, Mini. Are you that Gull-i-Bull? Ray's "appearance" was a total manipulation, and very last minute. That's part of the reason for it being 99.9% Content Free. It was engineered to help deflect some of the criticism/worry/angst/blogging about the sudden departure of so many execs and the absolute mess that Live is in. Blake is the first of what one can hope is many Partner-level kingpins who will be leaving RSN. Stay tuned. It's going to be fun to watch.
As an ex-MSFT, I could talk for hours about what is wrong with MSFT, its products, organization, processes and so on. However, the 3 things below – technical and business leadership and overall mission – seem (to me) to be at the root of every problem. Until all 3 are fixed, MSFT will continue to be a cash-generating giant that one day, like Colossus of Rhodes, may be shaken down, brought to its knees and never rise back.
Ozzie. I doubt Ozzie will do Microsoft any good any time soon. We live in the era of interoperability and integration. Both products Ozzie designed – Notes and Groove – have the opposite philosophy. Each is a complete self-sufficient closed universe and you either need to live in it entirely or give up on it. Because of that, Ozzie does not seem a great candidate for re-building MSFT’s technical strategy.
Ballmer. He’s a salesman. Steve Jobs is a product manager. If a company wants to create great products, a product manager needs to be in charge, not a salesman. Unfortunately, Ozzie does not look very convincing in that role (see above).
Mission. Most importantly, though, Microsoft lacks ideology, mission or any kind of a central theme. In early 90s it was “Windows on every desktop”. The mission was very clear – $50 from every desktop. MSFT rewrote all apps to be Windows apps to support the platform and Microsoft was an unstoppable machine for 3 years or so.
Then came COM. It was a piece of crap – poor implementation, bad developer tools, and practically non-existent guidelines. Nevertheless, the mission was crystal clear – all apps should be COM apps – and for 3-4 more years Microsoft repeated the same success. Too bad that COM pissed developers so much they fled to Java at the first chance.
DOTNET was a misfire – it was marketed to be as universal as COM, but everyone learned – in a hard way – that it is not. Microsoft could not unite neither community nor itself to rewrite everything DOTNET. Well, they tried (in Vista) and we all know the results – 3-year slip and yet another rewrite back in C++.
Microsoft needs a long-term mission that everybody, inside and outside, can understand and act upon. Don’t know about you, but to me “empowering people” sounds vague. It’s generic as solipsism – any software fits. “Better together” and “integrated innovation” turned out to be a disaster because developers translated it into an excuse to make tightly-coupled designs quickly turned to spaghetti code and inability to innovate. There was a great one – “information at your fingertips” – but for some reason it never became a central theme for the company and now Google has taken over it.
Without a mission, it’s impossible to create a technical or marketing strategy. Without a mission/ideology, Microsoft will continue to be killed by internal entropy and organizational Brownian motion. However, a salesman cannot create a great mission statement, and his peer product person does not seem to be capable either (see above).
So I'm one of those that is in the "eh, so what" camp on Ozzie. I really just don't get the hype...haven't seen the value yet. Not that we're looking for the dual Tablet wielding Moses here, but seriously, something more would be nice. Even the Goldman interview is substance-less and high level. WHERE ARE ALL THE LEADERS????
> I've got to steady myself... we're also planning to accommodate another... deep breath... 10,000 to 12,000 Redmond-area hires.
I am in HR and I am a positive person. I look at the positives and please do the same.
This is opportunity for 20-30 new VPs and 60-80 new partners. ( each VP has 3-4 partner quota )
This is going to increase the local house prices. We are going to get about 500 - 750 new HR people and possibly a new HR VP.
What I tell everyone: just buy a new machine to run Vista on. Unless you're a fan of flagellation (and relieving the sting of via blogging), don't upgrade an old machine that's collected precious application cargo and devices. Goodness forbid you have an unsupported Creative sound-card, for instance.
Don't tell your customers that Vista's a $1000 upgrade! That computer they bought last year or even the year before does everything they want in WinXP now, so why should they pay for a whole new one to run Vista?
The case for Vista has not yet been made to your customers.
I recently left MS after 7+ years for a local opportunity. Reasons:
Usual Suspects.
Maybe, I will come back in 3 years and re-join the feeding frenzy at a much higher level, with the level inflation I have been seeing before I left.
I wonder if this rapid hire is partly due to the 8% attrition rate MS has been seeing aka GE-ification.
Or, perhaps, MS is hedging for more
H1-b or L3 transfers in the coming years. Dunno. Or, perhaps MS has some secret projects in a bunker somewhere, which will lead to ultimate victory!
Come on, folks. Praetorian Prefect Kevin is cleaning house (see all the departures) while Emperor Steve is trying to stave off the barbarian horde. Who do you think will be the next emperor at MS? I think that Mini got his wish, but the dead weight is more heavily weighted towards the leadership, not just the rank and file. We shall see.
Recently I met someone, who started working at Microsoft couple months ago. While chatting, I asked her why she joined Microsoft, and her response was "great benefits!". I think that is the final drop and I realize I'm done with this company. When I joined many years ago, my response to that question was 'fun, making a difference, my code reaching to millions, learning lots of things from the gurus'. Those points don't seem to hold for a new hire anymore, which indicates how this company is viewed from outside. It is just sad!
There's a reason why Ozzie only merits a ho-hum reaction from anyone besides BG and the Monkey-Boy.
Have any of you ever USED Lotus Notes? I know it was wildly popular, but that buying decision was made by people who didn't know how easy it is to just set up an NNTP server for free. Notes is a very poor re-implementation of free software that had already been around for decades when Lotus was first touting CC Mail.
If that's your new Vision guy, then he's the one-eyed man with severe glaucoma in the land of the blind.
As an ex-MSFT, I could talk for hours about what is wrong with MSFT, its products, organization, processes and so on. However, the 3 things below – technical and business leadership and overall mission – seem (to me) to be at the root of every problem. Until all 3 are fixed, MSFT will continue to be a cash-generating giant that one day, like Colossus of Rhodes, may be shaken down, brought to its knees and never rise back.
This guy nailed it. Brilliant analysis of what is wrong with Microsoft.
"Have any of you ever USED Lotus Notes? I know it was wildly popular, but that buying decision was made by people who didn't know how easy it is to just set up an NNTP server for free. Notes is a very poor re-implementation of free software that had already been around for decades when Lotus was first touting CC Mail.
If that's your new Vision guy, then he's the one-eyed man with severe glaucoma in the land of the blind."
You're dead wrong about Notes. As one who taught Notes and Domino Admin and Basic Notes Dev, I can tell you that the combination of email, resource (conf. room, projector, etc.) scheduling, and database/website creation with the email was awesome!
Two problems: 1. Ram/CPU hog at a time (90's) when ram and clock speed wasn't there (I trained and entire huge law firm who was converting over from Wordperfect Office(?). It was more robust but sloooowwwww! Sys. Admin. got fired for the oversight!)
2. Programmers hate it! There's 3 languages to learn, all of them intertwined: Command Language (@), Lotus Script and Javascript.
I designed an entire web application using Domino and these capabilities. It allowed local small businesses to have instant websites with email marketing and instant online updates (say your gas price needed to be changed at your station). Works like a charm!
No, Ray Ozzie "geniused" that app, no doubt.
Remains to be seen whether he can do it now.
Have any of you ever USED Lotus Notes? I know it was wildly popular, but that buying decision was made by people who didn't know how easy it is to just set up an NNTP server for free.
I once worked as administrator and developer on the Domino/Notes platform, and I can assure you, that an NNTP server does not in any way match the functionality of Domino/Notes.
The best thing about Notes is how easy it is to crank out great workflow applications with integrated security, by using the "Domino Designer" client. Besides that Domino is cross platform, extremely scalable and extremely stable.
This is not to say that Domino/Notes doesnt have it disadvantages, because it certainly do. The userinterface sucks for mail, standards compliance is so-so (at best), the client is very fat, and the setup is pretty expensive too.
So I am not really surprised that the Exchange/Outlook combo won in the end. But still, an NNTP server is a far cry from the functionality that Domino/Notes offers.
And that leads me to my main point. While I admire the technical provess of Ray Ozzie, I really wonder if a "fat client" guy like him, is the right person to take MS into an open world of web-based services.
I have my doubts...
how much would 10k extra local hires cost?
Have any of you ever USED Lotus Notes? I know it was wildly popular, but that buying decision was made by people who didn't know how easy it is to just set up an NNTP server for free. Notes is a very poor re-implementation of free software that had already been around for decades when Lotus was first touting CC Mail.
If that's your new Vision guy, then he's the one-eyed man with severe glaucoma in the land of the blind.
I hated cc-colon-mail, as much because of a dumb product name as anything. (cc to mail? wtf? or "hey, our email lets you cc electronically", which implies that others don't) And Lotus Notes was overcomplicated for what it did.
Still, you have to admire the company for coming up with something close enough to equivalent to an intranet Usenet News, that they were able to get lots of people to pay them lots of money for it. This parallels the type of innovation that MS has had success with. Not necessarily coming up with groundbreaking ideas on its own, but commercializing ones it noticed out there in the wild. Windows? (Xerox Parc) IE? (Mosaic) Exchange? (MS' own version of taking a simple net tool, sendmail, and overcomplicating it because folks at MS couldn't tell back then that proprietary email systems were going the way of do-do's and everything would be TCP-based in the future.)
If I had to guess, the ability to commercialize technology, rather than to think up groundbreaking new ideas, is what some in the top ranks of MSFT see in Ozzie.
Without a mission/ideology, Microsoft will continue to be killed by internal entropy and organizational Brownian motion.
Sniff! That's just beautiful man. I think that's the first time ever someone worked that into a comment on business.
That concept so perfectly encapsulates much of what we seem to do around here. It goes beyond Dilbertism, Machiavellianism, even the rampant PUM/GM/Partner Necrotism (where you hire the brain dead and let them rise to power)
In the last couple of years it seems changes to compensation are used by MSFT to implement stealth cuts, so be careful what you ask for. In the field certain roles were eligible for a tenure bonus which rewarded us for staying on an account over a period of years. These tenure bonuses were very significant percentages of our base pay (ranging from 5% to 20%) depending on tenure.
Last year this significant incentive program was replaced with a quarterly revenue challenge. If teams meet all of their quarterly revenue quotas for the year they can receive up to 3 percent of their base pay as a bonus. Even the 3 percent is subject to limitations based on the number of teams that qualify and the amount of money available in the pool.
I'm all in favor of trying new things but not if it’s a thinly masked cut in compensation and benefits. While these stealth cuts may not drive hordes of Softies to the door it does encourage many to become Kims.
[ex-msftie, 5+ yrs, 2 years removed]
(add mock classic Ballmer voice) " I love this website!"
seriously. If anyone ever wonders how so many passionate folks end up at Microsoft, this site is an example. Even after we leave, its still part of the community we love to rant about in the hope that one day things are right in the way of the universe there again.
[insert real comment here]
For me, I came to the conclusion that I wanted different challenges than I was finding at Microsoft. sure the politics of the day made if difficult, but leaving was a way to find a better fit for my goals. Microsoft doesn't have to be in ruins for me to validate my reasons for leaving. Its still an amazing place. But for all of the readers/posters who want to put the place down because you're personally ready for something different, take the much talked about advice on the site and try your luck at a different table. If you were a worthy hire at Microsoft before, you'll be ready for the challenges and opportunities in the rest of the marketplace.
I am in HR and I am a positive person. I look at the positives and please do the same.
This is opportunity for 20-30 new VPs and 60-80 new partners. ( each VP has 3-4 partner quota )
This is going to increase the local house prices. We are going to get about 500 - 750 new HR people and possibly a new HR VP.
Wow. Everybody who has said here that HR is part of the problem, this guy just proved your point. Microsoft's going to turn into a black hole under the weight of all these new bodies (incredible mass, but emit nothing), and this guy's rejoicing because his kingdom is going to see growth. He's not looking at what's good for Microsoft, but only what's good for HR.
Seems to me like Microsoft needs to fire all of HR and start over...
MSS
10-12,000 more employees? Since that is not needed, I'd say someone is about to get burned bad. All Microsoft has to do is say they need that many, fail to get them, be allowed more H-1Bs, who work cheaper and are willing to work 80+ hours, and you Americans will be needed less and less. Microsoft has few options to increase profits so why not make drastic human capital cuts?
Lighten up people -- Microsoft is still a great place to work. It may not be the same place it was ten years ago, but I’m sure even back then there were many who were lamenting how Microsoft had changed, how the new hires weren’t as smart or motivated, etc. Besides, you’re not really as special as you think!
I'm so glad we're finally getting rid of Dan Ling... he was running MSR to the ground basically since Myhrvold was pushed out in 1999. I doubt Rico Malvar is the best guy to replace him. Malvar is a much better politician than he is a researcher. His main contribution was to tweak existing multimedia compression techniques just enough to get out of patent protection so as can use them and not get sued. Important, no question. Not very innovative. There are much higher quality people outside that we can recruit to run MSR. Let's think of Rico as a placeholder for the best of them.
What MORON designed the Mix 07 page? Do you realize that your target audience is web developers and designers, and not kids who are having their first drawing session in kindergarten. What the hell is this? Be PROFESSIONAL!!!
Bill Gates sold 20 million shars in February, netting $580 million:
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/filings-show-gates-sold-20/story.aspx?guid=%7B49EF9F15%2D1156%2D44BC%2DA94B%2D6C851DD00B63%7D&siteid=yhoo&dist=yhoo
So, the question is... should Microsoft hire me? :)
So, the question is... should Microsoft hire me? :)
With a body like that, how could we resist.
"Everybody who has said here that HR is part of the problem, this guy just proved your point.
MSS"
A little slow on the uptake today, are we?
>> All Microsoft has to do is say they need that many, fail to get them, be allowed more H-1Bs, who work cheaper and are willing to work 80+ hours, and you Americans will be needed less and less.
Not sure what your point is, but there are two things this blog has established -
1. Almost everyone at Microsoft works cheaper than what they can make elsewhere.
2. Almost everyone works 80+ hours.
I'd like to dispel some false notions here:
1) "The H1Bs are coming!"
- it is incredibly difficult to get an h1B visa since there is a cap of 65000 of these visas. This cap includes *all* the people that call be hired in *all* the companies in the US in one year.
2)H1Bs are "cheap labour" - As a new hire straight out of college, I am getting paid $75+ K per year... Which is about what any other new hire at MS gets paid.
by: newlyAssimilated
Right now, one shinning example of this to me is Windows Live Writer.
And Windows Live Writer would be...? Never heard of it before.
And Windows Live Writer would be...? Never heard of it before.
Geez, even Google knows the answer to that. Use the internets much?
Mentioning brains: I can only hope someone in Office leadership follows the yellow brick road running along One Microsoft Way soon and manages to get a big heaping dose of brains from The Wizard to help them figure out some compelling features for Office 14 before coding starts in, oh, less than two months. Or else it is going to be "Eh" all over again (I'm looking at you, Office 2003).
Right now, I am at a loss regarding what in the world it is we're going to be selling that is actually interesting to an end user. I ask people what they are excited about on their team and, by the look on their face, you would think they had just caught me with my hand in their pocket. Everyone is just shuffling along, spec'ing or developing or testing whatever boring thing comes their way.
And me? I'm doing informationals and it looks like I'll have some loops soon with some super-interesting groups. Thank God for Intent-to-Interview. I don't want to ship "Eh." I want to ship "Wowzee!" So long, Office!
" the combination of email, resource (conf. room, projector, etc.) scheduling, and database/website creation with the email was awesome!"
If that's your idea of "awesome", then you really need to get out more.
Of all the wounds inflicted on the software industry by Lotus and Microsoft, the worst is probably the abysmally low expectations I see all around me.
Regarding, "thank god for intent to interview", I'd like a clarification.
I can't tell, precisely, from the internal site, how this works. Do one's manager and VP still have the power to keep one for 3-6 months after one voices intent-to-interview, or can they only use that "ha ha, we can keep you if we want" trick BEFORE one has stayed in one's current group 18 months?
Does anyone know for sure? Guessing would be hazardous to my future on my present team, and I really just want to look around, just in case there's something that is a better fit for my skills elsewhere in the company.
> and this guy's rejoicing because his kingdom is going to see growth. He's not looking at what's good for Microsoft, but only what's good for HR.
-
I am not a guy. Lisa promised growth for people in HR. She said it was her top priority when she took the HR job.
How can you provide growth for HR management without hiring more people?
Think about it - HR is the most important function at Microsoft.
> I can't tell, precisely, from the internal site, how this works. Do one's manager and VP still have the power to keep one for 3-6 months after one voices intent-to-interview, or can they only use that "ha ha, we can keep you if we want" trick BEFORE one has stayed in one's current group 18 months?
Before 18 months, your manager can keep you from going. After 18 months, he needs VP approval to do so.
Either way, you have to tell your manager before you can schedule interview loop, so if your manager is of wrong kind, you are screwed either way -- once you announce intent to interview, you and your career are on lower level of priorities for your manager. You can kiss that promotion goodbye if somehow you do not get an offer.
"Think about it - HR is the most important function at Microsoft."
I would have to disagree with that statement because, I work in Building Maintenance and...well....Building Maintenance is TRULY THE MOST IMPORTANT FUNCTION AT MICROSOFT! At least when applied to KEEPING THE PLACE CLEAN!
HR is the most important provider of employee corporate Mission, Policy and Procedure. Oh, and it's the most important hirer of employees. Oh, and it's the most important towel dispenser at the Softie. But, like Building Maintenance, and IT, its role is one of "facilitator" to the primary missions of Innovation(?), Production and Sales.
Take your diamond-sequined blinders off, dear HR gal!
(Hmmm... This comment posting page doesn't display correctly in IE7. I have text overwriting other text.)
Anyway, Anonymous said, "WHERE ARE ALL THE LEADERS????"
This is a good question. The problem is that Microsoft doesn't attract or promote LEADERS. It cultivates MANAGERS. There is a big difference here. I'll leave it up to y'all to discuss the differences between the two verbs 'lead' and 'manage'. I'd suggestm making two columns and listing the synonyms for each word.
" the combination of email, resource (conf. room, projector, etc.) scheduling, and database/website creation with the email was awesome!"
If that's your idea of "awesome", then you really need to get out more.
We cut the workload of the "scheduling" secretary by a few important hours and...it became emphatically clear just WHO HAD SCHEDULED WHAT and WHEN. No conflicts, and running back and forth to the "scheduling" secy.
Same is true for the "meetings" function. Various levels of acceptance and rescheduling made it easy to set up a meeting with MANY people.
Those features, alone, made Notes....awesome! Attached to the management of resources was the ability to create databases of department and company information. Access rights handling to the databases was awesome!
And, to all you devs out there. If you want to create a website meant for many small businesses to use as local promotions for their products with with full email agents launching marketing events to your stored prospects...you cannot beat the Notes/Domino platform. It's awesome! Ray Ozzie knows this.
"Of all the wounds inflicted on the software industry by Lotus and Microsoft, the worst is probably the abysmally low expectations I see all around me."
Not sure what you mean by this, pardner, except that you should probably increase your Prozac dosage. Certainly Vista is a step backwards but, once you get past the "File, Open" shock of Office 2007, it's a nice little interface and...it's always been bleeding edge. Office Live, in theory, is a great app for small biz America. Not sure marketing and development are in synch.
No, there's some good software at the Softie and more good, I believe, from Ray Ozzie's group coming down the pike. His efforts have always been "elegant". Just review his past solutions, you'll see.
Hi, new to Mini-MSFT. What are Kim's? And how do they make great hires? Also, is there a site or network of ex-MSFT'ers since there seem to be so many of them about :-)
As a new hire straight out of college, I am getting paid $75+ K per year... Which is about what any other new hire at MS gets paid.
Consider yourself fortunate. Most H1-B holders I have ever worked with are contractors applying for permanent citizenship. To get laid off means being sent home to start the Visa process all over again, so they do whatever it takes to stay in their sponsor's good graces. They have to stay in the same job for years, getting paid whatever the company decides to pay them (hint: not a lot), until the magic year their green card arrives.
The reason I am against the H1-B program is not protectionism, as some like to call it. I am against it because these workers, who are here due to a supposed undersupply of skilled labor, serve to depress prevailing wages in our sector because of their fear of deportation.
The H1-B program is about companies saving a buck at the cost of American workers, and our compliant government enabling them. It's horseshit, and we all know it.
You just happen to be one of the lucky immigrants that didn't get a raw deal.
You're all grumpy. Try to be optimistic and look at the positive side of things. How will Microsoft grow and achieve when it's employees are complaining about how terrible their company is. Let's see you do a better job if you think management is so terrible.
"we're also planning to accommodate another... deep breath... 10,000 to 12,000 Redmond-area hires."
It's really very simple. Microsoft has two huge, incredibly profitable monopolies, and that means the only way it can keep growing at a reasonable rate, proportionally speaking, is to come up with another monopoly. And no one knows how to do that, so Microsoft just starts lots of new projects and hopes that one of them will pay off big-time.
And that is why, mini, your entirely understandable desire that Microsoft become lean and mean is just not going to happen.
I am not a guy.
OK, I wasn't meaning to offend you on the gender front. For a company that has 80/90% male employees (my guess), "guy" is more-or-less generic. But HR may not be that male dominated; I don't actually know. So, bad assumption, no offense intended.
Lisa promised growth for people in HR. She said it was her top priority when she took the HR job.
How can you provide growth for HR management without hiring more people?
See, that's exactly the problem. The goal of HR is supposed to be to provide the people that the organization needs in order to succeed. The goal of HR is not supposed to be to grow HR.
Think about it - HR is the most important function at Microsoft.
That actually is a reasonable statement - without the right people, the company is in trouble. And if posts here can be believed, Microsoft is in trouble because it has way too many of "not the right people". HR should be worrying about fixing this situation, rather than worrying about whether they can grow the HR department so that HR managers can "grow".
MSS
Think about it - HR is the most important function at Microsoft.
This person has got to be a troll. Even with the hiring bar so low, I can't imagine MSFT has hired someone this inane.
...How will Microsoft grow and achieve when it's employees are complaining about how terrible their company is.
Microsoft will grow when it addresses the problems of it's employees, customers and shareholders. Thanks for sharing your thoughts LisaB. Now, go back to caddying.
>> You just happen to be one of the lucky immigrants that didn't get a raw deal.
Who's to say what is a bad deal? Perhaps the right wage for a Software Engineer really is $250K/yr and it is being depressed by all the newcomers. The protectionist approach with regulatory and licensing hassles has worked nicely to increase wages in the healthcare industry.
>> ... serve to depress prevailing wages in our sector because of their fear of deportation.
12 million illegal aliens can testify that few if any people get deported. The only incentive that H1B employees have to stay with a bad employer is the fact that they lose their place in line if they have applied for a greencard.
"Think about it - HR is the most important function at Microsoft."
Ummm.... yeah. Think about this, instead. HR doesn't hire people. Product groups hire people. HR manages the goodies that help convince people to work for Microsoft. Ideally, HR should never have to be consulted because everything should be in place. Here are your forms. Fill them out. Never talk to HR again (if only it were so).
You want to gauge who's important? Ok, how much money does HR bring in every year? How much "HR" does Microsoft sell? What is our market share in HR?
Yeah, I thought so.
Most H1-B holders I have ever worked with are contractors applying for permanent citizenship. To get laid off means being sent home to start the Visa process all over again, so they do whatever it takes to stay in their sponsor's good graces.
Most H1-Bs at Microsoft are actually in position to leave as they wish. There is a law called AC21 (search the Internet for it, along with "Adjustment of Status" phrase) which allows people who are waiting for green card for a long time to change employers without penalty. Conditions are that you are waiting more than six months for adjustment of status, that you have I-140 approved (or it is reasonable that it will be approved) and that your job at new company has similar description.
Hmmm... This comment posting page doesn't display correctly in IE7. I have text overwriting other text.
It's fine in Firefox.
http://channel9.msdn.com/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=288708
Mentioning brains: I can only hope someone in Office leadership follows the yellow brick road running along One Microsoft Way soon and manages to get a big heaping dose of brains from The Wizard to help them figure out some compelling features for Office 14 before coding starts in, oh, less than two months.
I work in Office too and have a different experience. Most of the teams I work with (Word, Excel, Visio, Proj, Server teams) are well into feature-speccing and prototyping already. Some teams (you probably know which ones...) even have shorter term deliverables. I can guess that some teams (for e.g. the one where everyone left after 2007) are still in a state of limbo and are trying to figure out what to do for 14.
I interact with Windows on a frequent basis and I think things are significantly worse there, though.
This is a good question. The problem is that Microsoft doesn't attract or promote LEADERS. It cultivates MANAGERS. There is a big difference here. I'll leave it up to y'all to discuss the differences between the two verbs 'lead' and 'manage'. I'd suggestm making two columns and listing the synonyms for each word.
Actually, I'd disagree on a couple of fronts. First, Microsoft does not cultivate managers - you're wrong there. Managers at MSFT get shafted left,right and center. Our best managers leave the company or go back to IC work eventually. But, MSFT doesn't cultivate leaders either, so you're batting .500.
I say our problem is too many "leaders" and not enough "managers." You imply leadership and management are seperable functions. They ain't. Leaders who can't manage can't lead, and managers who can't lead can't manage. Leadership is vision, strategy and execution. When people talk about Leadership and Management as separate things (with Management always relegated to 2nd-class status), they're really saying "vision" is king. But vision is easy, and vision without strategy and execution is day-dreaming. The world is full of day dreamers.
The world is not full of people who can craft a strategy that will bring a vision into existence and then drive execution against that strategy. Those few who can are true leaders, and they also know how to manage, because that's a critical part of execution.
Microsoft has a bunch of day-dreamers who fancy themselves leaders. We have muddled strategy and very poor execution.
Most H1-Bs at Microsoft are actually in position to leave as they wish. There is a law called AC21[...]
Thank you for the feedback - it is interesting to note that there are further provisions. I would note, however, that this is additional overhead for the worker from the INS.
I would assume it is very time consuming to change status when jobs don't really wait around that long, though I don't know for sure; a speedy wing of the government is sure hard to fathom, though. If I was in the H1-B position, I would see this as additional risk for not much gain, especially since you have to apply for the same job function.
With regard to illegal immigrants versus H1-Bs, its a similar situation for the manufacturing and agricultural sector - fear of deportation and limited rights keeps the hourly wage down and the corporations happy. Build a fence along the border, you cut off the cheap labor supply. Give the immigrants citizenship, you get workers entitled to minimum wage who would unionize faster than you can say "Solidarity."
It's the status quo that corporate America wants: "Latin Rights" instead of "Roman Citizenship," so to speak.
In any case, my beef is with the H1-B program in particular. I know one Microsoftie who deserved far and above what his job classification was, but was stuck in place for almost 5 years. Not only was he being held back by this system, but his junior spot was not being freed up for the next rising star.
If immigrants could competitively bid for jobs like the rest of us, the market would be better off.
Blake is leaving because he can't stand Sinofsky, he doesn't want to follow Sinofsky's organizational principles and strategy and has simply lost the fight. Sinofsky is way too influential even for mighty Blake.
The fun part is gonna be watching the domino effect as Blake's MSN boys club gets dismantled for good. That division is doomed. By the time the long due cleanup is finished, the train to compete will be long gone.
Not sure what your point is, but there are two things this blog has established -
1. Almost everyone at Microsoft works cheaper than what they can make elsewhere.
2. Almost everyone works 80+ hours.
Well, #2 is quite wrong, at least in Office. There are orgs where "work/life balance" isn't just an empty phrase...
"You're all grumpy. Try to be optimistic and look at the positive side of things. How will Microsoft grow and achieve when it's employees are complaining about how terrible their company is. Let's see you do a better job if you think management is so terrible."
Well, mean 'ol grumpy me! I'm just not a "day" person, I guess.
I try and try to be positive and, when I am home or out I'm upbeat and fun lovin' but, when I round that curve at 1 Microsoft Way, I just start getting...well...mean and grumpy. Darn!
I just can't help myself. I know that if I just started acting happy and upbeat that, soon, schedules would be met, partners would give back their undeserved millions, software design would get customer input, stock prices would soar, the DOT/FAA would change their minds, Vista would work, secretaries would find the "File" tab, Zune would sell, Office Live would connect to itself, the EU would be happy, Britain wouldn't hate us for high Vista prices, raises and promotions would be democratic, Steve would shut up and Bill would stop screaming, "Fuck!" at meetings and the Softie would once, just once, design, create, market and sell something from scratch!
I would and could do a better job than management is doing but, I'll NEVER get that chance because...well...I am soooooo grumpy!
But vision is easy, ... The world is full of day dreamers.
Just because you have a daydream doesn't mean it's good and everybody should execute on it.
People at Microsoft get confused about this all the time. "Hey, we can use a database for a file system!" Well, uhh, maybe. "Hey, we can make a search engine like Google!" Err, I guess? And so on...
This is a good question. The problem is that Microsoft doesn't attract or promote LEADERS. It cultivates MANAGERS.
Though I've read follow-up posts that disagree with you, I do not. You've stated very clearly one of the largest MS problems.
My experience is that these managers who are unable to lead grow in stature at the company but seek concepts, ideas, etc. from below. In an ironic twist, these managers are often the very people that Microsoft has defined as keenly necessary to the company's future success.
The type of individual who can act as both a leader and a manager exists, but they're very very rare. I've known too many leaders who qualify as visionaries but are horrific managers (as they see their perspective and only their perspective). I've known far more managers who can corral people, but would bore the dead and have no idea how to separate 'good' ideas from 'bad' ideas.
>"You're all grumpy. Try to be optimistic and look at the positive side of things. How will Microsoft grow and achieve when it's employees are complaining about how terrible their company is. Let's see you do a better job if you think management is so terrible."
We here at MS just have higher expectations of our leaders than maybe you have at your workplace.
A sharp analytic mind is a key asset here and, like any giant company, we have our issues.
We bitch because we care. If we didn't care, we'd just leave.
Most H1-Bs at Microsoft are actually in position to leave as they wish. There is a law called AC21[...]
I would assume it is very time consuming to change status when jobs don't really wait around that long, though I don't know for sure; a speedy wing of the government is sure hard to fathom, though. If I was in the H1-B position, I would see this as additional risk for not much gain, especially since you have to apply for the same job function.
Actually, read a bit more about AC21 -- there is no need to file any forms, send anything to USCIS, nothing. Assuming you have your EAD (conviniently provided by MSFT, but everyone can just go and apply for one if he/she is in 'adjustment of status' phase), you just show at new job and use it to prove eligibility for working. Once your priority date (old one, there is no new one to speak of) is current, either of two things can happen:
a) INS will send you green card without questions;
b) Sometimes, INS will call you for RFE appointment (request for evidence) where is enough to present that you work in similar job as in previous company and that you have worked for old company during six months period after submitting I-485 (pay stubs are fine). Note that burden of proof is now on INS -- they have to go extra mile to prove if they suspect that you have abused the system.
So, all in all, there is no much risk. I am not a lawyer, consult a lawyer (preferably at prospecting company :), your mileage may vary.
Anonymous @ 4:44:
I am speechless. Sheer brilliance, sir (or madam). Well done!
"2)H1Bs are "cheap labour" - As a new hire straight out of college, I am getting paid $75+ K per year... Which is about what any other new hire at MS gets paid."
MS pays $80-95k+ to agencies for the average contractor.
I came across a pretty startling find today. Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_bob) says "Despite its ambitious nature, Bob failed to penetrate the market and is considered Microsoft's worst program, and their largest failure.
...
The project leader for Bob was Karen Fries, a Microsoft researcher.
"
Look her up in outlook. SHE'S A PARTNER. If you can make a mistake like this that has gone down in MS-Lore as the biggest joke in product development in almost 2 decades - what can we say about the future of accountablility of partners?
Now only if MS hired that research guy from that east coast CS skool before google did. I heard that he presented his military research to MS BEFORE he went to google, but MS ignored him. Didn't even give him a talking rain lime soda! I heard that google paid big $$$ for him to join, instead going back into military research. Heard his stuff will revolutionize search (again). Old news...
I am not sure who was in the meeting, but man, someone definitely screwed the pooch here. I wonder if analysts read here... :) Look it up. 'Tis be true.
In regard to billg's recent capital hill sermon ... he should be distressed. In virtually every instance where a U.S. CS grad had the option to join Google or MS they chose Google. The grey matter has to come from somewhere - I guess we'll have to issue more H1Bs. The immigration thing does need work, but how many U.S. grads today saw their parents, uncles, cousins displaced during the tech crash or had their companies bullied under by the (today) curiously conscientious Mr. Gates? Many were victims. Many even who worked at MS were victims of Gates' rapacity. Who would want to join an industry or a company like that? It was good theater for Gates to be on the hill at the same time Rubin was scolding Google on IP rights. It was all very macabre and hollow sounding - and so out of place considering Mr. Gate's overall track record.
"the first of what one can hope is many Partner-level kingpins who will be leaving RSN. Stay tuned. It's going to be fun to watch."
Chris Payne - another one bites the dust. Having had him and his friends and family hiring policy drive the MSN platform into the deck he managed to repeat it Search too.
Of course I'm sure as he jumps out of the plane that his stock parachute will mean a soft landing in a pile of greenbacks though.
I'm only jealous.
Christopher Payne's leaving too
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/business/306479_msftpayne07ww.html
Well you have to give KevinJo some credit for cleaning house in the exec ranks of his org. Although portrayed as a decision to pursue 'other opportunities', it clear this is an attempt to shake things up in both the Windows area (moving in BillV) and the disaster that is MSN and Windows Live. Who is next on the chopping block?
>> MS pays $80-95k+ to agencies for the average contractor.
In fact it pays a little bit more than that (110K+ even for engineers), but that number does not include any benefits or the propect of career growth. On top of this the agency takes a big bite out of the billing rate so the a- does not get all the money.
The OPs $75K number is base salary to which you can add 17+K in medical/dental/vision/heath club, 5K in stock based compensation and 5-7K in annual bonus and the opportunity to get a merit raise every year. For the a-, it is a better deal overall to be a fte.
>You want to gauge who's important? Ok, how much money does HR bring in every year? How much "HR" does Microsoft sell? What is our market share in HR?
--
Sir, you are ignorant of the value added by HR. We account for all the revenue brought in by Microsoft. You may ask how?
HR is the only group which interacts from a fresh hire to execs. HR is the only group that talks to product dev, legal, finance, support and research.
HR keeps the whole machine moving. HR has assembled the best HR from fortune 500. If you assemble the best team, one has to provide career growth.
The rule of thumb is one HR for every 20 employees. The ideal ratio is one HR for every 10 employees.
> Christopher Payne's leaving too
-
A great man leaves and search is orphaned.
I would and could do a better job than management is doing but, I'll NEVER get that chance because...well...I am soooooo grumpy!
"Sounds like someone's got a case of the Microsofts."
The rule of thumb is one HR for every 20 employees. The ideal ratio is one HR for every 10 employees.
what !?!?! I need HR on the day I start my employment to explain me the 'benefits', to hand out the forms I have to fill in/sign and receive such forms. Then when I quit the company to go through the 'Exit Interview'. That's it. I don't deal (nor do I want to) with HR at all during my whole employment - Seems like this type of job is a great candidate to be outsourced overseas, or replaced via a SharePoint site.
>> In any case, my beef is with the H1-B program in particular.
No, rather your beef should be with the abuse of the H1B program both by private participants and the government. It is just not credible to complain against the entire program when there are tons of counterexamples to every bad apple you point out.
>> I know one Microsoftie who deserved far and above what his job classification was, but was stuck in place for almost 5 years.
This has nothing to do with the H1B program, rather everything to do with job performance and his ability to manage up. You can accept ladder level promotions and go from sde to sde lead while staying on the H1B. Where it does put a crimp in matters is if you want to change disciplines.
The OPs $75K number is base salary to which you can add 17+K in medical/dental/vision/heath club, 5K in stock based compensation and 5-7K in annual bonus and the opportunity to get a merit raise every year. For the a-, it is a better deal overall to be a fte.
I know a guy (STE) who was laid off from MSN last December and, a month later, came back to MSN as a- for $12,000 more a year (after Excell Data deducted benefits -- granted not as nice as Microsoft's, but for a bachelor it will do)
Sir, you are ignorant of the value added by HR. We account for all the revenue brought in by Microsoft. You may ask how?
HR is the only group which interacts from a fresh hire to execs. HR is the only group that talks to product dev, legal, finance, support and research.
HR keeps the whole machine moving. HR has assembled the best HR from fortune 500. If you assemble the best team, one has to provide career growth.
The rule of thumb is one HR for every 20 employees. The ideal ratio is one HR for every 10 employees.
While I'm glad to see that LisaB's folks are monitoring Mini to get the pulse on FTEs at MS, I'd have to say that I've been extremely disappointed by the rantings that the Lisa Clone has been providing of late.
"HR keeps the whole machine moving....one has to provide career growth." I don't quite see how HR is "keeping the whole machine moving", while I can't say that I was overly thrilled with the previous review process, I'm even less impressed with this whole "Career Compass" BS. "One has to provide career growth" Why? Maybe I LIKE my job, maybe I'm GOOD at it, maybe, just maybe, I don't WANT to be a manager? I like being a grunt in the trenches who is working with our end-customers day-in and day-out fixing their problems that they encounter deploying our software. Why did my mid-year review go from being "here is how you're doing so far, here is how you can improve by the end-of-year review" to "where do you want to be when you grow up?"
It IS NOT HR's job to have me waste time that I should be spending working with