Microsoft FY11Q2 Results
A quick check from the last Quarterly Results leading up to today's Microsoft Quarterly Results:
- What's great: Kinect. We sold millions of Kinects and it's full of cool! And we have a 93% customer satisfaction rate with Windows Phone 7. Looking around, I think that's also assuming that 93% of Windows Phone 7 handsets sold are the Samsung Focus.
- What's good: our reputation is working through the bothersome-hated-defeated-spurned-ignored-renewed-respected cycle compared to Google.
- What's okay: Windows Phone 7: we sold some to non-employees and two-million licenses are in the channel. I have no idea what that means with-respect-to actually sold hardware. But it's no KIN, so... success! Yeah.
- What's really, really bad: the iPad is gnawing away our laptop market. And a new version is coming out soon.
Hungry Hungry Cannibals: reading Ms. Friar's last beat-the-hell out of Microsoft Goldman-Sachs report just about made me permanently hungry for human flesh given the repeated fixation on cannibalization. I swear, I'd look up from my print-out occasionally and longingly eye my more fit co-workers.
It's the iPad baby, and - booga booga - it's going to destroy Microsoft. Well, at least destroy Windows.
First all: sure, Microsoft leadership deserves all the head-bashing it gets for both mobile and small form-factor markets. We had the jump on these markets with inelegant, uninspired devices that never had a chance of taking off with consumers and no one was bold enough to reboot the product line without successful leadership from Apple showing us the way.
Next: our iPad-compete strategy is unspoken. For good reason. Just about any application developer at Microsoft can tell you that it's a secret wrapped in red. Most Microsoft-observers have put the pieces together and figured out our strategy could be and realize who could be on point to deliver something exceptionally cool to compete with Apple. This will certainly could be our bet-the-company chance to validate the tortoise-vs-the-hare fable.
How have our past tortoises fared? I can think of three recent late to market responses: Zune HD (iPod - remember those?), Kinect (Wii), and Windows Phone 7 (iPhone / Android). All great devices. In order for our possible iPad compete story to be a success, it has to pull a Kinect and be beyond the competition vs. a me-too or, well, me-kinda-sorta.
CEO Changes: Mr. Ballmer's respect meter in the ephemeral tech-business... news (?) world is still low. Kinect has helped, but questions linger regarding what he's doing with his leadership team given Muglia's upcoming departure. I had always remarked to folks that Bob's a survivor. His time just finally ran out. It will be intriguing to see what leadership steps in or up and what happens to Bob's current team. And who might be next. Bets? Unless HR is about to unleash something huge that's been in the making my first bet is on LisaB. Also, Craig, I'd love to know what successes you've brought to the company as of late.
In the midst of Google and Apple going through leadership changes, you've got to ask: who is on the bench to replace Mr. Ballmer? What is the Board's plan? I have to reject Ms. Foley's point of view that there is no-one that can replace Ballmer. That's a too big to fail leadership jail sentence. Perhaps the decision is that his departure immediately results in a broken up Microsoft and the presidents he is putting in place now would be quite capable of running those sister corporations. Given the convergence and consolidation that is happening internally on a number of fronts for future development, such sister corporations would be much more dependent on each other, so it's not as whacky - or dog-eat-dog cannibalistic - as it might have seemed in the past. Given that the consent decree is considered over, Microsoft self-breaking itself up will certainly help prevent penalties when the inevitable violation occurs.
From another angle: if the Sinofskyfication of the company continues (IEB now with its massive re-org complete, post-Muglia Server & Tools next?) then Mr. Sinofsky ascending over a whole Microsoft will be a moot decision.
Interesting coverage after the results:
- Amazon adds thousands more workers; Microsoft still cautious - Mr. Todd Bishop looks at the hiring trend of Microsoft, Amazon, and Google. Want to find a new job? Knock on Amazon or Google's door. Microsoft is pretty much a flat-line.
- Microsoft tops estimates; Kinect fuels Xbox; Windows 7 hits 300M - Mr. Todd Bishop again.
- Microsoft Sees Business Tech Spending Continuing to Rebound, Benefiting Office and Windows Ina Fried Mobilized AllThingsD - Ms. Ina Fried
- Microsoft’s Results Easily Beat Expectations paidContent - Mr. Joseph Tartakoff
- Microsoft Q2 2011 by the numbers Record $19.95B revenue, 77 cents EPS Betanews - Mr. Joe Wilcox.
- Microsoft Beats The Street, But Not By Enough To Send Stock Soaring - Mr. Matt Rosoff
- Why Microsoft Desperately Needs To Become More Acquisitive - Mr. Robin Wauters. Dude. More acquisitions? Really. aQuantive still blows my six billion dollar mind. Can someone help me remember some of the recent good acquisitions that Microsoft has made. Is it better to make none or risk some of these money vaporization deals we've done (stupid billion dollar bat).
In general, no surprise to people that Windows/Live was down and that Entertainment was up on the Kinect. Online (aka Bing aka Partner-Level-Palooza) lost over half-a-billion dollars. And gained a bit of market share.
Pulling out my crystal ball that's covered with dust along with all the other Mini implements used to write this blog (oooo, an unopened bottle of Col Solare! Score!): Microsoft product groups should feel good about WP7 and the influence Metro is having around the company. Like I said, there's a big convergence ahead of us, and it will be good to start aligning a simpler development story, both for Microsoft and its partners. The biggest obvious concern is the development path for the mobile platform compared to the development path for Windows, but even there you can squint and see on the horizon the possibility for that to be successful, too.
IE9 is great technology that yes, has a way to go to score some high compliance number across a bunch of random folk's assessment sites. Still: wow. WP7 is a modern joy to use and is slowly building an app catalog. Kinect. And a whole bunch of developers hunched over and hammering bits to create the next big "Wow." Yeah, "Wow" might be inscribed on the back of a tortoise, but sometimes... the tortoise wins in the end.
The only thing that concerns me right now is (and you're going to love this): hiring. We've got great successes that excite people about working at Microsoft, but really, how many more people are we hiring to work on Kinect? My friends and I have never been so courted by other companies. Not since 2000. And I've got to say, the culture that Ballmer and LisaB have created is really weary. It's enlightened for the mid-1980s. But if crazy stock price jumps are no longer enthusing your employees, you've got to reboot the culture.
715 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 601 – 715 of 715We lost a good SDE recently to start up. :(
The coming wave of attrition will be the final nail in Microsoft's coffin.
The rentometer.com claims that $1500 is about the median rent for a 2br apt in Kirkland.
Learn to cook (rice and bread flour are cheap, and a roasting a chicken is fast and easy and provides leftovers), cut back on the non-essentials.
Very exciting. Great to know what I have to look forward to when landing a highly skilled position at one of the most wealthy corporations in modern history..
Right. But is the curve making people miserable? Is that what's sapping people's enthusiasm? Is that what they get for a year or hard work? I can attest for fact that my A/10 made me a miserable basket case. It's damaged my self-image. It's make me doubt that I should even go on living. I would gladly give up a 4% raise for a year of not hating myself because of what Microsoft told me I was worth.
+1
It's not you. They are playing these review games with everyone, trying to get people to think the problem is them. Its all a bunch of BS.
I'm the guy who posted the stuff in italics, and I wanted to thank the person who responded in boldface for their +1. It honestly helped my perspective. Especially since some other opportunities are, slowly, finally, starting to show up.
I'm sick of this culture. I mean I'm actually getting physically sick because of this culture. It's only through realizing how much I might contribute to another company that I'm sustaining myself through another day.
It's just sad that Microsoft has become the epitome of a place people want to get away from, rather than come to. But that's exactly how it is. My co-worker's leaving at the end of April. I have never seen him so happy in the 8 years I've known him.
Hopefully I'm next.
[Responder]
Am I being an ass? Maybe. Do you deserve it? Absolutely.
[Dev Lead]
I'm a Dev Lead and I can tell you one thing: I would not want a guy like you on my team.
When I meet with my directs, I always emphasize teamwork, working together, and helping
each other. Anyone who's not a team player will get a 10% and be out there as soon as
the next review cycle comes around.
Hey "Dev" Lead,
There is a place for being good to others and helping out. And there is a place for calling out the situation for what it is - which is: "more than a decade in the industry and being clueless about recruiters"
Say, you got someone hired in your team with 10 years in native development in a different team. And he says "I cant understand this C++ compiler warning. What should I do? Should I rebuild hoping that it goes away? Where should I look in the compiler reference manual for this error?" Would you as a "Dev" Lead want others in your team to lend more than a helping hand? Let me assume you are great because you said you ooze great with the emphasizing and all, everytime you "meet" your "directs". For now you would get someone to help the guy, but
be honest, and tell everyone - would you not put in a word in the next 1:1 with the guy saying "Hey I didnt expect you to not know that stuff"?
This is the exact sentiment the responder is expressing on the OP. What you would say, as a "Dev Lead" behind closed doors in a 1:1, is being said more directly in an open forum. I agree with what the responder has said, although the language could have been less profane.
And what's with that "Dev Lead" tag. Do you think you are a superior human being because you are a "Dev Lead"? That your directs are lowly orcs who need
"emphasizing". That your directs wont know they should help each other out, without you
"emphasizing" it to them. What makes you assume that the responder wasnt a "Dev Lead" himself? This "entitlement" culture is tiring. You could be a "Dev Lead" or you could be
CEO:SteveB and you could do all the "emphasizing" you want, but without the 3 Rs (reflection, relationship, resilience), you are not worth the "Lead" you have in
your title.
I can also confirm Google pays better even for senior positions. Better pay, better culture, better perks, better morale, better products, data driven, more customer focused, and growing.
The only reason to stay at Microsoft is if you really just can't live without an office or you didn't pass the Google loop. But hey, you won't know unless you try.
Its not a perfect place by any means, but Microsoft isn't even close.
@I'm smiling, I hope that is not an overreaction. :)
Your reaction was expected as usual.
This attitude is not allowing Microsoft to grow further since last 10 years. Financial Data is classified. :)
I have got 2 consecutive A:10s and what should i do???
Honestly given the climate I'm stunned you survived your first A/10.
Basically an A/10 means you'e meeting your expected goals compared to your peers within your job level, but there is no potential for you to grow within Microsoft. You're basically being told, you're doing a good job - but you will never get promoted. Your stock awards, bonuses and raises are going to reflect this, "you've hit a wall," rating.
What should you do? Update your resume. Get on the Ladders if you're making more than 100K, post to Monster, reach out to recuiters, work your network, copy any work you've done so you have records of it for examples and references, if you have an office full of "stuff" I would discretely start packing it one box at a time over the weekend.
You're cooked - and you'll likely be managed out by July. It is just the way it is.
If you haven't interviewed in years you definitely should invest in some classes on interviewing skills, and get professional help with the resume. This will be some of the best money you can spend.
As a hiring manager I can tell you the single thing that is killing 90% of the candidates I see that have been out of work for 6+ months is a complete lack of interviewing skills; and I suspect it is a major reason why they are facing long term unemployment.
But don't sit at your desk, paralyzed, thinking you have job security. You have a huge target on you. Be proactive, take control, there are a lot of job openings out there at great companies.
"Tons of news about the massive discrimation lawsuit against Walmart. http://www.bing.com/news/search?q=walmart+class+action. But did you know that MSFT is among a few who jumped in the fray on Walmart's side? WTF!"
MSFT is afraid that if this large of a class action is permitted, employees will bring similar class actions against them.
I can think of one: people doing the same job with better performance who are under-leveled because...oh, just because that's where they were leveled and they have to be in a level for x months before they can be promoted.
Forcing people to stay in a level for x amount of time and not compensating them the same as other people doing the exact same work seems ripe for a lawsuit to me. (Oh, and punishing them SIMPLY for being in a level for y amount of time seems pretty troubling as well.)
Reminds me of how Gates and Ballmer decided to reward their employees:
Gates/Ballmer: 1 dollar for me.
G/B: 1 dollar for you (employee).
G/B: 1 dollar for me.
G/B: 1 dollar for you (next employee).
G/B: 1 dollar for me.
G/B: 1 dollar for you (next employee).
G/B: 1 dollar for me.
G/B: 1 dollar for you (next employee).
G/B: 1 dollar for me.
G/B: 1 dollar for you (next employee).
G/B: 1 dollar for me.
....
So insider scoop for an ex-FTE please: did Mich Matthews jump from being an SVP, or was she pushed? Did the PR disasters mount up until WP7 and force her hand? Please - dish :)
Positions in every sub outside the US are leveled at least 2 levels below the US. I remember around 2006 seeing a L65 job in Australia running all of MCS in Australia/New Zealand with $80mill P+L responsibility, something that in Corporate MCS would be a GM ... not sure how that translates to salaries in Singapore. At least there you can't spit on the sidewalk without a permit so that is a bonus.
After far too long, I am taking my leave of MS. It is a shadow of the company I joined a very long time ago.
Today, I sat in disbelief in a staff meeting where the managers were caddy about 20s vs. 10s.
Way back before Win95, MS's reviews were not curved. In fact, I had a note that said the 3.0, 3.5, 4.0 distribution was hovering around 1/3 times 3 and it was undesirable to have that specific mix. A non-bell curve was "unnatural". It was the beginning of forced distribution. A few years later, mail from this SteveB guy stressing the need to create a more differentiated compensation model. The unintended consequence was people had the realization that the real competition lies within their peer-group or organization and not the other competitive products. I deliberately use the term "organization" instead of "team". The sad truth is that messages like "we all beat brand-G together" are a bunch of BS. If as much energy was expended on winning instead of internal one-upsmanship, the customers would win, the employees would win, and the shareholders would win. IMO, the original distribution was unnatural in a large group, but was more indicative of inconsistent assessment across teams and divisions. Getting more crisp about criteria by which assessments are made, a natural bell curve would have "magically" appeared.
For the vast majority of my time in the company I was a fanboy. The products were cool, the people were geeks and damn proud of it, the people were treated very well, and we had laser focus on building the best product possible. The company routinely was THE "best company to work for", THE "best tech company", and other industry recognition. I have not seen MS on any such polls or rankings in a long time. Not anywhere in the top 100, let alone number 1.
We still have some cool products, but tremendous waste of resources, money, and people. Everyone mentions Kinect. It is a cool product. The new wireless Arc mouse? If you haven't seen it, go check it out! It is really cool.
I have told many people over the years that when it is no longer fun, that is when it is time to leave. The fun has been beaten out of me. Hard work can (and used to) be fun. It is time to go have fun, again!
If Mundie and leadership team think that tablet is just a pad, then the company is doomed.
Apple sold 15 millions ipad's last year, that's a lot of revenue for a fad.
@Saturday, March 26, 2011 3:01:00 AM
So you're saying this doesn't need to be changed? Is it working?
I dont think the people complaining here can change their U10 to A-something, much less change the company. I am not implying that they are incompetent, but just that they are stuck in a bad situation and are not trying to get out of it.
I said the rest of what you said, minus the emotion. People are being treated as resources and if you dont like it, do something about it.
1. MSFT won't pay for your GTG pass? Too bad so sad - move closer to your job, as in live in the same city. No bridge, no toll, no problem.
2. When recruiters call/email:
- Greet them in a professional and friendly manner. Tell them you aren't looking at the moment, but that it's always nice to know people are interested, and what is the job?
- Listen to the job overview, if it's interesting at all, ask them to send the details to your home email. Ask them what the salary range is, since you aren't especially intersted anyway. A lot of times if they will say the $$$, it's a lowball, and you can say something like, huh, I don't know anyone who would look at the job for that, maybe you should put that out to college recruits. Tell them to send the info anyway, and you will take a look at it, maybe ask around to see if someone might know someone.
- Tell them you are happy where you are right now (whether it's true or not), but who knows, check back with me in a few months.
- Or, just cheerily thank them for their interest, and tell them to give you a call some other time if they ever have something with XYZ company, or a job in some specified $$$ range. Why all the friendly and cheery? Because they don't get that a lot, and if you do it in a professional manner, they will like you and even remember you.
Once the answer to the "if you ever have something with XYZ company" was, "Well, this IS with XYZ company" and when this turns up, you talk a little more.
So do keep your options open, it doesn't hurt to make a few friends with general tech recruiters, or the recruiters at your main competitors. Don't worry about wasting their time, it's their job (sort of like a real estate agent's job is to show houses to possible buyers, their job is to try to find people who match their open jobs, and not every encounter is going to make for a match). And they called you.
If you want to go on an interview, that's going to actually use up some of your time, so make sure they are really interested before you cough up a day of vacation or personal leave to talk with them in real life. Again, it's just you chatting with them to see if their job might be a match with you, and you will both consider whether or not it's a good fit. If you haven't interviewed at all in the 13 years, it's good practice to do it every once in a while. You will either be interested or not, and that's fine. If it turns out to be a great job for you, wouldn't you want to have looked into it? Never hurts to find out more info, so answer a recruiter or two.
Not sure why you got so much crap about the question of what to do. Just go ahead and see what they have to offer, then decide if you want to proceed.
«Think about how laptops changed how people use computers. For some people — maybe you — they didn't have much impact. For other people, they changed the entire game. The iPad, and I'm sure the high-end Android tablets as well, are that kind of change all over again.» Not sure I would go that far. Laptops are useful without connectivity, iPads less so. Apps execute locally on a PC regardless of OS, and the user is not nickle-and-dimed by AAPL or the carrier to endlessly buy applications. At present and in the mid-term I think iPad and similar tablet form-factor devices will supplant laptops in limited scenarios for business users, whereas consumers can do fine with them. Longer term, Microsoft has a problem because of its lack of innovation in the consumer space and over-dependence on enterprise customers. Cloud solutions delivery will get slicker over time for business apps and local execution capability will become less and less relevant, which spells trouble for Windows client ...
Respectful (and respectable) disagreement, how cool!
Not sure how the app store factors into your argument, because you end up having to buy apps for either computers or tablets, but the connectivity issue is certainly valid to a point. Sooner or later, you have to dock to get OS updates and sync up, but I've gone as long as 2 months without docking.
My iPad experience says end-users, especially the not-so-savvy type, love them. They're mostly using it to hit Facebook, check email, scarf a little porn (smacks the boarder in question), none of which requires apps that aren't already built into the iPad. I grabbed a couple extra apps, but the ones I use nearly all the time are free. If I had $250 to just throw around, I'd get a Nook Color and root it (which turns it into an Android tablet), then see how often it gets used compared to the iPad.
I don't see cloud computing impacting Microsoft too much. Windows has a lot of inertia, and can live on it for a long time without losing much beyond the margins. Far too many desktop apps think "cross-platform" means running on XP and Windows 7. Even if you move apps to the cloud, unless they're Flash or HTML5, they'll mostly run native and I expect the current inertia to continue.
I am sorta surprised that SteveB got 40% approval rating:
http://tcrn.ch/h7wLAG
"2. When recruiters call/email:
- Greet them in a professional and friendly manner. Tell them you aren't looking at the moment, but that it's always nice to know people are interested, and what is the job?
- Listen to the job overview, if it's interesting at all, ask them to send the details to your home email. Ask them what the salary range is, since you aren't especially intersted anyway. A lot of times if they will say the $$$, it's a lowball, and you can say something like, huh, I don't know anyone who would look at the job for that, maybe you should put that out to college recruits. Tell them to send the info anyway, and you will take a look at it, maybe ask around to see if someone might know someone."
Please don't give advice if you don't know what you're talking about. Seriously, there's no harm keeping your opinion to yourself if you don't actually have something meaningful to contribute.
1. NEVER tell a recruiter that you're not looking. You're ALWAYS curious to hear about awesome opportunities as far as a recruiter is concerned, even if you have no intention of leaving your current situation.
2. The quickest way to get on a recruiter's don't call list -- and to reveal yourself as an ass -- is to make a snarky retort about a potential salary range. Never, ever do that, even if the salary is far below your minimum bar. Should you hear of a job opportunity with a salary significantly below your target, politely let the recruiter know that the salary range isn't a fit, and should they press you for details (because sometimes they're really just fishing to get an idea of what companies are paying for the job you do), don't reveal your current salary but do respond with something like "the range you presented is in the neighborhood of 20-25%% less than I'd typically be looking at."
Respectful (and respectable) disagreement, how cool!
Not sure how the app store factors into your argument, because you end up having to buy apps for either computers or tablets [...]
Buying apps for a desktop system isn't the same as buying an app for an iPad. People won't shell out $500 for a full copy of MS Office on the spur of the moment, but they will impulse-buy a 99-cent app that does some useful (or whimsical) little thing. So the comparison isn't really valid.
My iPad experience says end-users, especially the not-so-savvy type, love them. They're mostly using it to [Facebook, email, etc.] none of which requires apps that aren't already built into the iPad. I grabbed a couple extra apps, but the ones I use nearly all the time are free.
Yeah, they love them. People are playing games on their iPads; using them to do banking and stock trading (in spite of the security issues); doing work with photos; setting up their DVRs and watching TV shows; it goes on and on. There's even a remote desktop client that lets you TS into Windows. And more than one person has commented that, compared to a netbook, they start up very quickly.
I don't see cloud computing impacting Microsoft too much. Windows has a lot of inertia, and can live on it for a long time without losing much beyond the margins.
Two points here:
* You don't move a company into the future simply by slowing the bleeding. That's not a growth strategy; it's only a way of postponing death for awhile.
* It's dangerous to assume that the impact of technological changes will only affect the "outer edges" of the business. It's equally dangerous to assume that it will take "a long time" for the impact to become significant. Back in the early 1990s, Digital Equipment Corporation famously ignored the potential impact of PCs (and client/server in general) on their workgroup minicomputer business. Within a few years, DEC's business was gone -- and it all happened much faster than anyone expected.
At a deeper level, the challenge Microsoft faces isn't "the Cloud" as a technology; rather, it's very broad change in people's expectations. To quote Bill Buxton, "It's not the devices that are mobile; it's the people." People expect to be able to access and interact with all their digital "stuff" (music, financial records, personal and work email/calendars, social networks and contacts, personal photos, medical records, games, etc.) no matter where they are. The computer (specifically, the PC) isn't a destinantion anymore; it's just one of many ways of accessing your digital "stuff." Amazon's recent "music cloud" offering illustrates this idea perfectly: Your music, available wherever you go.
So far, Microsoft's "leadership" shows no sign of understanding this major change in society. Instead, Craig Mundie delivers slogans about "three screens and a Cloud," or makes lame pronouncements about "in the future, the computer will be a room that you go in." [DOCTOR MEMORY: "It is estimated that no underwear will be worn by the year 2020."]
Back in the early days, BillG articulated a very clear, powerful vision for Microsoft: "A computer on every desk and in every home." That's a vision statement. Every plan, every action the company took could be checked against that statement. The time when that vision made sense has passed, but Microsoft has no equivalent vision to move it forward. Instead, there are empty marketing slogans ("We're all in for the Cloud"), or descriptions of an implementation strategy that still includes Windows ("Three screens and a Cloud").
For Microsoft to survive and prosper (rather than just bleed to death more slowly), the company needs to figure out how it can fit into a future that looks like, "All your digital stuff, wherever you go."
I dont think the people complaining here can change their U10 to A-something, much less change the company.
Obviously the posters on this blog aren't the only ones that see it. Everyone sees it.
http://tech.fortune.cnn.com/2011/03/31/microsofts-office-why-insiders-think-top-management-has-lost-its-way/?section=magazines_fortune
Reminds me of how Gates and Ballmer decided to reward their employees:
Gates/Ballmer: 1 dollar for me.
G/B: 1 dollar for you (employee).
G/B: 1 dollar for me.
G/B: 1 dollar for you (next employee).
...
There has never been a better time in history to be a corner office manager at a big corporation.
But for the rest of us working class peons, our day-to-day reality and families future looks very different.
Basically an A/10 means you'e meeting your expected goals compared to your peers within your job level, but there is no potential for you to grow within Microsoft. You're basically being told, you're doing a good job - but you will never get promoted.
--
There is no potential left to grow inside Microsoft, period.
In our ranks we have thousands of managers, seniors, principles, and partners - many of whom never earned or contributed anything of actual customer facing value during their tenure.
Most are a product of a better start date, easy tech money in the 90's, and an inward focused culture which has continuously rewarded all the wrong things.
Microsoft refuses to hold them accountable, and because of their tenure or title they refuse to clean-house and out them.
So what you have today is a #$% jam of self-important people that work as a glass ceiling for the rising talent on the floor that wants to innovate and see real change in the company.
The coming wave of attrition will be the final nail in Microsoft's coffin.
/
Microsoft's countless product blunders, failed acquisitions, and strategic missteps in the market are NOT the dev or test team's fault.
They want to play games on my next review? Lets see how excited your new college is about learning how a hundred million lines of legacy C++ code written in 1985 works.
It took me fifteen years, so just about the time the IPad 11 comes out.. they should be about up to speed.
Respectful (and respectable) disagreement, how cool!
I don't see cloud computing impacting Microsoft too much. Windows has a lot of inertia, and can live on it for a long time without losing much beyond the margins.
OP here ... thanks for the compliment :)
In the interests of transparency I have to admit I am a long-term ex MS employee who works for a cloud computing provider.
No question that Windows has the momentum to be around a long time, however a lot of cloud-hosted MS apps - think Exchange, SharePoint even Lync - can be consumed with any browser on just about any OS. Granted, a rich client like Outlook gives you more, but not much more, than OWA. Lots of people running virtual Windows sessions via RDS, opening another way to ditch their PC.
Keep in mind too that MS invested $2bill last year in cloud infrastructure and BPOS/O365, so the company's expectation seems to be that this is important for Microsoft's future. Now IF ONLY CRM 2011 did not require IE {sigh}
Not sure why you got so much crap about the question of what to do. Just go ahead and see what they have to offer, then decide if you want to proceed.
Thanks very much for your detailed and informative response. I truly appreciate it and it gives me a lot of useful insight now on how to proceed when communicating with recruiters.
As to why I've gotten so much crap for asking this simple question, I have no idea. The hostility was definitely surprising, but I suppose it may be a reflection of why Seattle was recently named the most miserable city in America. You have so many rude, unhappy, and unfriendly people here, and a few of them are no doubt participants in this blog.
MS's review system is insanely stupid. We are chasing people out of the company by assigning them to be bottom 10%. Then we struggle to hire a suitable, or more often less qualified, replacement. That replacement then takes a year to ramp up to have the skills/knowledge/experience to do what the now departed 10% employee used to do. It's just plain stupid.
>> The quickest way to get on a recruiter's don't call list
The less interested you are, the more interested they will be about you, provided that you have an interesting resume. And not just interesting "within Microsoft", bu interesting to someone on the outside; there is a difference.
Although asking for salary ranges from a recruiter is just plain stupid. They don't decide the salary ranges. You'll never get an answer. Your best bet is to take a look at e.g. Glassdoor.com and see what the salary range within your expected band is. Do note that for Google, the salary bands are outdated - you should really be multiplying them by 1.2 or so.
I have got 2 consecutive A:10s and what should i do???
I'm an experienced manager at Microsoft, so I can give you some insights/perspective.
First thing, you won't be fired for an A:10, you will only be fired for a U:10 (or trending towards it).
Do you like your job? If not, then it's simple, look for a new one. However, if you do, then try to figure out if your manager would prefer you leave the team (I would even recommend being as bold as directly asking). If the manager would prefer you leave, then look for a new job, because that's a strong sign that they see a U:10 is probably coming soon.
However if you're happy with your job, and your manager is fine with you being on the team, then you don't have to do anything.
In terms of looking for a new job, it's going to be extremely difficult to find a manager inside MS that will hire someone with back to back A:10 reviews. So looking for a new job primarily means looking outside the company. The reason MS managers avoid hiring people with a 10% rating is because of the informal "up or out" policy, it doesn't mean you don't have skills. Other companies will only care about those skills, so it likely won't be too difficult for you to find a job with a new company.
I was told my rating is u/10 in mycd. please advise what should I do ?
@MS's review system is insanely stupid. We are chasing people out of the company by assigning them to be bottom 10%. Then we struggle to hire a suitable, or more often less qualified, replacement. That replacement then takes a year to ramp up to have the skills/knowledge/experience to do what the now departed 10% employee used to do. It's just plain stupid.
and then we rate the same replacement again as a 10% employee...and the practice continues :)
MS's review system is insanely stupid. We are chasing people out of the company by assigning them to be bottom 10%. Then we struggle to hire a suitable, or more often less qualified, replacement.
Though, it is a great way for gruntled middle-managers to get rid of disgruntled underlings.
To the gruntled middle-manager, the replacements are not so much "less qualified" as they are "less expensive" and "less of a threat".
Becoming a gruntled middle-manager by surviving the next review cycle to have a chance at advancing to the next level is the goal of many at Microsoft.
Why former employees say Microsoft can't innovate
1. Based on communications with current and former employees, Microsoft's midriff problem is one of middling middle management. The number of middle mangers swelled over the last decade, and they also are the employees making key management decisions, which includes who gets laid off or fired and where the remaining people work. What manager will fire himself or herself? (Before continuing, let me be clear that only former Microsoft employees will be quoted, and anonymously at that. Current employees would only communicate with me on background, for concern of risking their jobs).
2. One former employee, whom I'll call Boris, had this to say about how last year's layoffs affected him and his former team: "Out of a starting staff of nearly 20, four remained, all managers. I'm not sure what they manage."
3. "When I started at MSFT in 1996, there were six people between me and [Microsoft cofounder] Bill Gates," Boris said. "In 2009, there were 13 people between me and [Microsoft CEO] Steve Ballmer." Fred said, "the number of managers between me and the CEO went from six to 10," during the last decade. Another long-time Microsoftie, whom I'll call Barry, saw his reports go from six to 12.
4. The point: Microsoft is shedding top-level managers all while middle-manager ranks add bulge to the organizational structure.
5. Incentives that Discourage Risk, Innovation
Related to gut-bulging middle management: some HR review and compensation processes discourage many employees from taking the kinds of risks necessary for Microsoft to regain its competitive edge and, quite frankly, to innovate in truly meaningful ways. Microsoft's definition of innovation, for most of its product groups, is anything that preserves the status quo -- meaning extending Office and Windows and increasingly server software like SharePoint and Windows Server. Risk is a dirty word for many employees looking to advance at Microsoft.
A former employee whom I'll call Rodriguez said of the HR review process: "Microsoft has become too 'scorecard' heavy and highly litigated to the point it kills an employee's spirit of free thinking and creativity, since everything a person does is closely judged by management." Among the former Microsofties I communicated with over the last couple of months, Rodriguez was the harshest critic of Microsoft's review process, which he observed is going on right now; fiscal year ends on June 30 and reviews occur midway.
We are chasing people out of the company by assigning them to be bottom 10%. Then we struggle to hire a suitable, or more often less qualified, replacement. That replacement then takes a year to ramp up to have the skills/knowledge/experience to do what the now departed 10% employee used to do. It's just plain stupid.
In leaner times, lower management prefers less skilled directs. Many have atrophied in their own skills over the years. They want to look better by comparison. Productivity and results from an existing employee isn't as desirable as a malleable and less capable new hire.
The goal is to show their lead that things are running smooth. They don't want to be the ones to get the axe.
::snip:: Most are a product of a better start date
Personal merit has never been a factor. Your start date is the only thing that ever mattered at Microsoft.
For those on the tail end, you are kicking a dead horse. It is time to move on to greener pastures.
The replacement then takes a year to ramp up to have the skills/knowledge/experience to do what the now departed 10% employee used to do.
The strategy is known as "rank and yank" or "Walsh Syndrome" as it is most often associated with GE / Jack Walsh. It was also used by Dow Chemical, Enron, and a handful of others.
It has made a come back in recent years because small gains in company efficiency have translated into huge personal short term gains for big company CEO's.
It can work in some sales orgs, but not so much in software shops and comparable disciplines whereas people rightfully expect to be rewarded based on their own merits and contributions.
Read the book "The Cheating Culture" by David Callahan on google books.
The result at other Fortune 500 companies has been an inward focused, politically charged culture that rewards being great at office politics, not for a job well done.
Before long employees see each other as the competition. Managers lie and write false reviews to save face. Instead of helping each other, employees are polarized and focused on who is going to take bucket C, or cut out of bucket A. At Enron it led to widespread employee misconduct and fraud.
Sound familiar?
Personally, the reason I came to Microsoft was because I was passionate about creating a great, competitive product. I loved the tech. I felt like I could kick our competitors butt all by my lonesome.
Most importantly - I felt like if I worked hard, was a devoted employee, with a little guidance by those wiser than I- that one day I could make partner and see the big bucks.
Nothing could be further from the truth.
MS's review system is insanely stupid. We are chasing people out of the company by assigning them to be bottom 10%.
The best of the best bubble to the top, of course.
That replacement then takes a year to ramp up
But the remaining 90% have the fear of (insert deity of choice) instilled in them. No way they want to be part of the next 10% to go. So mostly the slack is taken up, or at least hidden.
This is what management sincerely hope is true.
I am also worried about the comming attrition. I think the company had a great opportunity to really build up some loyalty during the recent downtimes in the economy. Instead of ripping the band aid off quickly they did three seperate layoffs that really impacted a small % of the company, they made everyone worry. Then they announced what amounted to a paycut(New Benefits).
I am hearing of a number of very good sales people already starting to leave. If you are in the field you are told you have to move to Redmond or you are going to get a 10%.
In my mind Microsoft has alot going for it. I think our products are good. WP7 and our cloud services have a shot now that our chief marketing fool is gone. Maybe a mass exodus of people may be what it needs. Microsoft will need to reinvent itself as nimble flexible company that rewards its employees that stay.
5 years since leaving Microsoft I'd say most dramatic difference I witness... when a bunch of Microsoft managers gathered at review time it sounded like they were launching the space shuttle with all the lingo and number crunching, debating, etc. ... when any normal company does same it sounds like a honest, open normal communication between regular humans... and is much shorter in length, doesn't stir up the masses or distract from the job at hand. Besides the obvious product innovations issues at Microsoft, they have to completely abandon the current review process.
Speaking as a perennial E/20 IC who has won multiple gold stars...
I really think the review system is long overdue for some tweaking. The whole concept of A/10 should be completely scrapped. Not even the IBMs and GEs of the world inflict this on their workforce. There are a handful of very competent level 61s and 62s on my team that have no interest in being managers or having a fast promotion velocity. However, as my division/org seems to have no interest at all in promoting IC SDETs to the senior role (reserving that for leads that flame out), they're stuck getting A/10s and end up with no real rewards come review time.
Honestly this really makes me feel uneasy because I am on the track to becoming a lead and would have a very difficult time delivering an A/10 to someone who is doing their job competently. Don't get me wrong - I'd have no problem at all U/10'ing someone who simply isn't cutting it. But at the same time, I can't tell you how many people our team has "no hired" because they just didn't show any skills or potential. And yet, here we are willing to lay people off who know the job and can do it well, simply because a mandate comes from Bldg 34 that we have to cut our bottom 10, regardless of whether or not they're competent.
MS's review system is insanely stupid. We are chasing people out of the company by assigning them to be bottom 10%. Then we struggle to hire a suitable, or more often less qualified, replacement. That replacement then takes a year to ramp up to have the skills/knowledge/experience to do what the now departed 10% employee used to do. It's just plain stupid.
Many of the 10%ers being chased out are senior and principle ICs with 10+ years at MS. It takes way more than 1 year to ramp up to that level of experience and performance.
So you're saying this doesn't need to be changed? Is it working?
I dont think the people complaining here can change their U10 to A-something, much less change the company. I am not implying that they are incompetent, but just that they are stuck in a bad situation and are not trying to get out of it.
I said the rest of what you said, minus the emotion. People are being treated as resources and if you dont like it, do something about it.
Like what?
Not to be flippant, I really agree with what you're suggesting - but for the sake of others who feel hopeless, what? Is there a company that can use us? Will attrition to companies who can use our insight finally wake up Microsoft, or will they just be as fatalistic as many of their employees feel and just give up?
I just want to have the hope that you're suggesting we have, and how to get it. I really hope you're right. But so many MS'ers, like myself, feel really hopeless right now, so it's hard to see how we can actually be progressive as individuals at times. Personally I've given up on MS being progressive. The top brass doesn't have the patience.
Thanks for your response.
Very open and respectful:
Steve Ballmer should follow John Chambers mea culpa example.
Best wishes for all non +VP employees !!
A former country general manager who loves Microsoft although not a share holder anymore.
The Strategy: Cut at the bottom, party at the top.
Read this in a foreign newspaper: Big Steve's 'approval rating' with employees dropped to below 40%
Steve's 2010 bonus was cut in half because of 2 big misses: Ipad and Mobile.
And the revenues keep breaking records so Steve isn't going anywhere until at least 2018....
Fresh rumors have it that LisaB and SteveB are working on a long-term plan (5 to 10 years) to significantly cut back on benefits.
I can also confirm Google pays better even for senior positions. Better pay, better culture, better perks, better morale, better products, data driven, more customer focused, and growing.
The only reason to stay at Microsoft is if you really just can't live without an office or you didn't pass the Google loop. But hey, you won't know unless you try.
Its not a perfect place by any means, but Microsoft isn't even close.
By senior you mean "Senior SDE", isn't it? Because after you get into the C2 compensation plan, even recruiters in Amazon and Google will tell you: "It is impossible to offer you a better package than what you have".
Unless... you are underperforming. If your reviews are something like U/10, A/10, or even the lower bucket of the A/70, then your golden handcuffs are not so golden. Otherwise, believe me: I'm a principal with mostly 20% and 70% stock for the last 5 years, got offers from both Amazon and Google recently, and literally started to laugh. Meanwhile, I do see why underperforming principals would leave for these companies, but that is beyond the compensation discussion.
Interesting article on the early days of MSN/Live search (pre-Bing), and a small keen hungry team developing it, and how it went corporate and lost its focus
http://myprasanna.posterous.com/birth-and-death-of-microsoft-bing
Report Says Sales of Motorola's Xoom Slow
Ouch...only 100,000 units sold compared to millions for iPad2 that's been out for less than a month. Googlers, your Chrome OS (if ever released!) will bomb even more.
See, it's not enough to bunch up singleton uber-geeks together and hope they will create a product appealing to non-uber-geek masses. If you hire one-trick ponies, your company will always be a one-trick pony.
Hey, isn't 25% of Google's bonus now tied to success in social? Looks like your compensation will be going down, LOL.
Not waiting to be laid off, will be leaving Microsoft this week, what to watch to not leave $ at the table?
Anyone experienced MSFT tried to make you stay and not quitting?
Milestone in company transformation: two years ago today blue-badges outnumbered temps by over 17,000. Today, the company has an even split of FTEs and temps as our total headcount has climbed over 3,000 in the past two years.
Ah thanks, so that's where my job went.
"MS's review system is insanely stupid. We are chasing people out of the company by assigning them to be bottom 10%."
Once upon a time there was deadwood to clear. (Not that we always got it right.)
Now many groups are finding that the bottom 10% are still strong performers. On some strong teams they can (and do) move and become a 20 elsewhere.
For those on the tail end, you are kicking a dead horse. It is time to move on to greener pastures.
Wow ... what a bunch of mixed metaphors! Although I am not sure what a dead horse would care about green pastures.
As much as seeing U/10 ICs move on, I don't see as much attrition at the management level, especially upper management. Take Kin as a colossal failure, but Roz Ho is still around. Sure she was demoted to a GM, but is she not U-10?
Re: Different levels in subs vs. corp
For engineering, that is not true. HR did a "global leveling" exercise a couple years ago that brought everybody in line.
For SMSG, it may be true, but comp structures in SMSG are completely different (large variable component).
And it really just matters how the pay structure lines up within the local environment.
When SMSG folks transfer sub-to-corp, their level gets adjusted. The other direction is unfortunately typically done with underserved MGR packages.
Interesting article on the early days of MSN/Live search (pre-Bing), and a small keen hungry team developing it, and how it went corporate and lost its focus
http://myprasanna.posterous.com/birth-and-death-of-microsoft-bing
A commment on the above blog post is a good response:
I looked you up, and I can understand the frustration that you feel, having to leave an awesome team inside Microsoft, a rare jewel indeed, free from bureaucracy that generally entails large companies, for whatever reason you may have left.
Bing is not dead, far from it. Gaurav is still extremely influential, and very much attached to his baby. Rohit's decision to leave was multi-fold, and while some of upper management may be to blame, it was just his choice.
Bing is doing great things, in 18 months since you've left we've gone back to the monthly release cycles, we're pushing the envelope once again. It's not about beating Google anymore, it's about making Bing the technology that is far superior.
It takes time and effort, and there are lots of smart engineers who are emotionally connected to Bing now, I'm serious -- I am!
For what it's worth, your post has been read by the key people you've mentioned here. It does bring back memories, but we're still going strong!
I hope you cheer for us!
Hav.
Anyone experienced MSFT tried to make you stay and not quitting?
I left a few months ago and was asked by my manager if there was anything he could do to change my mind. I rightly said "no" (while thinking "Are you out of your mind?"). Once you have given notice you need to leave. Even if you are given a promotion (or promise of promotion) to stay, your loyalty to the company will be questioned and your co-workers may resent you. I love my new job and wish I'd left MS years ago.
Whats up with internal transfer? It seems to be getting harder now for ICs. I am hearing that Management want to raise hiring bar for internal. Being Senior dev with good reviews and long time MS FTE, I just realized that I can't compete with new hire since I can't provide best solution to tricky algorithm questions. But I can develop good complex product which is not important. Interviewer showed me how smart he is by describing his challenging work which in his word not everybody can do easily. Wow..
I was not able to answer his tricky algorithm (including graph), which I should know bring FTE, uhh. Interviewer (manager) told me that he is looking for someone with high IQ.
Back to original group until I find something outside. Bye bye my 60 hrs/week hard earned un-vested stock award.
JJ with avg IQ
Regarding attrition, I am starting to see many companies increase hiring...I am an L65 IC and am surprised to see so much activity in the market, and have a lot of great companies wanting to interview me right now.
For all of those on this site that post about how terrible MS is, your chance do do something about it is now...go brush up on your interviewing skills and hit it, lots of organizations are all ears...
Because after you get into the C2 compensation plan, even recruiters in Amazon and Google will tell you: "It is impossible to offer you a better package than what you have".
This is what the recruiters say at first, but if you are good enough that they want you, you are in a position to negotiate.
And after having been through it myself, at some point, no amount of compensation, health benefits, or perks can overcome a role/team that makes you miserable. Life is too short.
Windows Phone 7 updates for ATT phones are begining to look like the never delivered Vista Ultimate Extras. ATT was suposedly the global launch partner for Windows Phone 7 yet Microsoft can't seem to get any cooperation from them. In the meantime I've recieved iOS 4.2.1, 4.3, and 4.3.1 for my ATT 3G iPad. How come Apple is so much better at updating than Microsoft? Oh, and don't get me started about the promised support for SD cards in the Samsung Focus. Not going to happen. Super disappointing.
I have been saying this for some time. MS goes where the puck is, not where it's going. That's why you guys fail! MS is so into chasing the iPhone that they missed who the real player will be - Android.
You give too much credit. The right adaptation of Wayne Gretzky's famous quote is "Ballmer is like a hockey player who keeps furiously skating to where the puck once was, not where it is right now, and certainly not where it will be"
Many of the 10%ers being chased out are senior and principle ICs with 10+ years at MS. It takes way more than 1 year to ramp up to that level of experience and performance.
Honestly, though, what does it matter if you're a top performer at Microsoft? How much of your day is still spent on overhead like fixing build breaks and otherwise managing the (probably) asinine build process for your product, going to pointless meetings to discuss some random thing that was already decided 3 other times, doing 1-1s and other managerial nonsense, and if you're very lucky you can spend a few minutes coding your feature that will probably be redesigned again by incompetent PMs for the next milestone.
People think that just because they go to work 10 hours/day and are busy the whole time that they're productive and valuable but I'm pretty sure that if 9 out of 10 people at Microsoft just disappeared tomorrow, it would ultimately be inconsequential to the products. Actually the products might be better. If the entire Windows division went on vacation for 7 years instead of making Vista, the world would be a better place now. People need to reevaluate what it means to be a "high performer."
Mgmt can always screw up motivations/passions by making wrong decision over and over... going from solution a to b to c ...
I am an Exceeded employee for most of my almost 10 years here in the company. Lately I don't feel like killing myself to help them succeed.
i am actually doing 9 to 5 (without going to lunch) and spending a lot of time after work on my own App to launch in different AppStores.
Don't think I will have problem getting offers from other tech company BUT how would I get 9 to 5 jobs and giving me enough time to innovate my own product and trial+error.
Good job MSFT, your stock price, management, decisions, policy etc.. made up my mind to 1-day (hopefully soon) do my own startup full-time.
Best wishes to everyone in agony.
Like a failed marriage or any relationship, no need to rationalize why it didn't last, just recognize it's not a match. It's good to call it off.
Avery
By senior you mean "Senior SDE", isn't it? Because after you get into the C2 compensation plan, even recruiters in Amazon and Google will tell you: "It is impossible to offer you a better package than what you have".
Unless... you are underperforming. If your reviews are something like U/10, A/10, or even the lower bucket of the A/70, then your golden handcuffs are not so golden. Otherwise, believe me: I'm a principal with mostly 20% and 70% stock for the last 5 years, got offers from both Amazon and Google recently, and literally started to laugh. Meanwhile, I do see why underperforming principals would leave for these companies, but that is beyond the compensation discussion.
I am the OP. By senior I meant "Higher level" not any specific title per se since titles aren't standard across companies.
To your point, I absolutely can see how if you'd racked up a few 300% of target stock awards in the principal band that it could be hard for companies to match out the door. What your missing is that if you performed comparably at Google (no information about Amazon, sorry), you would rapidly be better off (and happier).
Also, don't forget that this year's 20% is next years 70% and eventually 10% after your length in level is climbing up. Are you really going to make 67? Partner? If so, good for you, but not the vast majority of Principal level people who will cap at 65 or 66.
In my experience people capable of consistently performing at 20% in the Principal band are frequently 1. not motivated by money in any case, or 2. political creatures climbing the ladder. If you are the first, you should move. If you are the second, you should stay.
I started out trying to post to actually help someone (like me not all that long ago) who might be trying to make a decision and felt trapped by their golden handcuffs. Find out for yourself what kind of offer you can get.
Peace.
Interesting article on the early days of MSN/Live search (pre-Bing), and a small keen hungry team developing it, and how it went corporate and lost its focus
http://myprasanna.posterous.com/birth-and-death-of-microsoft-bing
They were informal and they broke rules. Microsoft has specific directions for teams in the US to not hire in other countries competing with the local branch offices. Gaurav, went to India and hired some of the best hackers right off school, ignoring Microsoft's directions. Back then, no body really offered positions in the US right off indian schools. This was totally new in the market.
Bing was extremely lavish in compensation, making offers to the best hackers for $90K/year when the adjacent teams were making $75K/year offers. This was the time when Google was making $80K/year offers.
Great patriotism from Gaurav Sareen. Hiring a lot of people from his home country (even though there is an IDC) and paying them 20% more than what others were getting. Clap .. clap..
Not waiting to be laid off, will be leaving Microsoft this week, what to watch to not leave $ at the table?
Anyone experienced MSFT tried to make you stay and not quitting?
1 - If a group knows you want to leave, but needs more time to get someone up on everything you know, they will make an offer to keep you. But, don't expect good reviews after that since they know you are not happy and have already looked for another job at least once. Gives you more time here for slightly better money, but expect to be treated differently.
2 - Knowing that you are looking for another job, they'll slam the door on you ass on the way out. They may boot you the day you tell them you are either looking/found another job.
3 - If you are already looking for another job, you are obviously not happy with your current situation. Why would you want to stay, and why would a group want to keep someone that is unhappy enough to be looking elsewhere?
Unless... you are underperforming. If your reviews are something like U/10, A/10, or even the lower bucket of the A/70, then your golden handcuffs are not so golden. Otherwise, believe me: I'm a principal with mostly 20% and 70% stock for the last 5 years, got offers from both Amazon and Google recently, and literally started to laugh.
Care to share the Approximate numbers?
To the piece of work riding his bike at leisurely speed on 156th at 8 AM on 12th April:
You are certainly entitled to your ‘green’ initiatives and your health, but not at the detriment of the people riding 145 behind you almost till the main campus. Everyone on the bus including the driver was cursing you and had question about lineage.
Either ride at a decent speed or ride on the footpath (which you did after we were near the main campus)
Interesting that Larry Page, the ever-smirking GOOG CEO, decided to cut a management layer and created 7 decisions to 'reduce bureucracy and speed decision making'.
If memory serves that is what Ballmer did - split the company into 5 divisions in 1999, 7 P/Ls in 2001 (?), then 3 divisions in 2005. Stock price has not moved.
Today we have 17 'senior leaders', of whom just 6 - Delbene, Lees, Lu, Mattrick, Nadella, and Sinofsky run product groups. The other 10 excluding the grand-exalted poobah SteveB are various kinds of researchers, HR executioners, strategists, bean-counters and advertising hacks. You know, baggage.
Why not let Walmart-Boy run the finance, HR, Research, marketing etc, have one technical advisor / CSA reporting to Steve and be done with it. I can guarantee that Turner would quickly sort out some of these bloated support orgs.
Odd that Page should pick something out of SteveB's playbook. Spells the beginning of the end for Google i say.
>> By senior you mean "Senior SDE"
I mean "strong SDE who has been with the company for a while". I see little to no correlation between being "principal" and doing well in an interview. I know principal people who have tried and failed. OTOH, I know a couple of partner folks who moved here and we all know what kind of compensation packages they have at MSFT, and what kinds of lifestyles they lead.
Basically, it's as close to meritocracy as I have seen anywhere.
Fresh rumors have it that LisaB and SteveB are working on a long-term plan (5 to 10 years) to significantly cut back on benefits.
If you were worth 15 billion, would you care about benefits?
For the rest of us, maybe install mesh nets around the outskirts of all the buildings. Just in case..
Many of the 10%ers being chased out are senior and principle ICs with 10+ years at MS. It takes way more than 1 year to ramp up to that level of experience and performance.
Stupid. Ridiculously, insanely, stupid.
Of course, this is Steve Ballmer we are talking about. Never the sharpest pencil in the box.
A hiring freeze is coming to Office within the next couple of weeks. Any similar information in the other divisions?
And so the demise of MSFT as an empire nears.....WANG Computer, DEC, Compaq, etc., etc., it happens to all great companies. The centralization of power with incompetent fools and yes men like Satya Nadela is when the empire started walking towards a ledge.....good luck Ballmer - you are indeed the most myopic, narcistic and selfish human on the planet...thanks for screwing up a GREAT company....you will go down in history as one of the worst CEOs....trade is already calling you that. Have some grace and class and leave now....
I was told my rating is u/10 in mycd. please advise what should I do ?
anytime u have a 10, u r hosed. it would be hard to find another job inside but it's possibly.
so look outside and get sick over it. just remember that it's just one manager or one org trying to screw u. the world is not against u.
Now many groups are finding that the bottom 10% are still strong performers. On some strong teams they can (and do) move and become a 20 elsewhere.
Impossible. Other teams won't put you in a loop if you're 10% - even if you're in the 'Achieved' group
"Now many groups are finding that the bottom 10% are still strong performers. On some strong teams they can (and do) move and become
a 20 elsewhere."
Frank Holland put the kibosh on U/10s and A/10s changing jobs inside Operations. You're stuck until you dig out of the hole you're in, or you're managed out.
That should make DaPunk happy.
SQL Server fosters a supportive and productive work environment. SQL Server is known for providing growth avenues for developers to reach the highest levels. The team culture values engineering quality, technical excellence, and grass roots innovation.
The above was part of a SQL Server Principal SDE job posting brought to my attention by a friend looking for work. I am currently in the STB org and will be giving notice around 4/18. I decided to leave specifically because of the non-collaborative work environment brought about by the review system (i.e., Oracle is not my competitor, but the guy in the next office is) and the absolute lack of career growth for an IC over L65. The job description made me laugh hysterically. It’s “Sycophants on Parade” in SQL Server -- the partners strutting their stuff to make sure there is room for them in Nadella’s org (also laughable). My best advice is to stay away from Microsoft and certainly from SQL Server.
IBM's market cap is approaching Microsoft's. We lost the biggest tech company crown to apple last year, by this yearend Microsoft may be knocked to 4th spot. If this is not a wakeup call for our board, what would be?
http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=msft+ibm+goog+appl+market+cap
I always act uninterested with recruiters, and they keep calling. I think it's fine to say you are happy where you are, and this seems to make them try harder to pitch their job opening. I always ask EXTERNAL recruiters (who are looking to fill stuff for another company) about the salary ranges, and they do tell me, usually lowball. That's when we have the discussion about who might be interested in that sort of range, although unfortunately it's not me. Because I have a set of skills/education/experience, we almost always talk a little longer, if I am willing. I don't chat all day, but long enough to satisfy my curiousity about their opening, because I have sometimes ended up interested. If I am not, I say so, they usually ask if I know anyone who would be, and sometimes I do know of someone, and I pass it on. I do say things like "however, if you ever have something at this title-level-range, give me a call" and we leave the future open. Even if a cold-call recruiter was a little surprised that an experienced person doesn't jump at their first offer/info, that is their need for education, not mine. I agree that it is hard to squeeze salary info out of recruiters, which is why I also choose not to disclose mine in the early stages, if at all. I figure it is their job to have some sort of idea of the pricetag associated with my skillset, just like you would have a general idea about the price of a starter car, or a luxury high-performance model.
Again, if they are calling you, you should remain in control of the conversation. The initial question on this whole concept was from someone wanting to know how to handle the recruiters who call/email you regarding an opening that they have decided might interest you. I don't set out to tick them off, but if the range is so out of line with my requirements that I would not consider it at all, and I think it's an entry-level type of salary, I do indeed tell them that. Is it "insulting" to them to find this out, that they are offering a low salary for experienced people? I have no idea if it is oh-so-surprising for them to find out you can't get the luxury high-performance car for the price of a base model Honda.
Wow. Given GOOG results it seems that Google pinned the tail on a donkey (Page) whose stature as an ass is as large as SteveB's. Quite the achievement! Congrats!
Page seems as easy to fall prey to distractions from the main game as Steve. Wind-power, automated cars ... what else can I say.
The computer industry is at a dead end. When Jobs breathes his last, the will be the end of innovation, and the beginning of its journey as a utlity, much like power companies. Though, I've enjoyed the ride!
Lost a good SDE2 to Amazon. Know several other MSFTs who've gone to Amazon as well in the last year.
I have got Exceeded and 10% for two year in a row. I thought it was a strange combination and I'm going to a different company in a month. I feel sorry for the next person that will soon to be victimized as the new 10%.
Fresh rumors have it that LisaB and SteveB are working on a long-term plan (5 to 10 years) to significantly cut back on benefits.
Then could they possibly start with cutting the bottomless beverage BS Ballmer was so freaking married to during the '09 layoffs? God forbid we have to start using our spare quarters for a Coke Zero when we could just lay off a guy with four kids.
It’s “Sycophants on Parade” in SQL Server -- the partners strutting their stuff to make sure there is room for them in Nadella’s org…
+1 – Especially in SQL Systems Engineering, the GM’s a little general. Several well respected SDEs have left since this once side-lined partner was given a second chance.
> Don't think I will have problem getting offers from other tech company BUT how would I get 9 to 5 jobs and giving me enough time to innovate my own product and trial+error.
You can try orange-badge contracting, either at MS or another company. You only work for time that is paid, if you take a lunch hour (unpaid) you can work on your own App project at that time, and still enjoy the evening with your family...or more time working for yourself. Granted, you won't get paid as much, but you could probably get the rent paid, keep the lights on, and eat while you pursue your dream.
For the rest of us, maybe install mesh nets around the outskirts of all the buildings. Just in case.
That might be funnier if my husband hadn't gone up on the nearest thing he could get to the roof and stared off for a while, the day he started the medical leave that was the beginning of the end.
The next day, his manager called him to ask when he was coming back.
The day he did finally go back, his new manager said "I heard you were coming back just to quit."
Such nice people. Such lovely, kind, understanding, compassionate people. Just the sort of people you would want to pour your life's blood out for. Lovely people who deserve every bit of loyalty you can muster. I'm sure they'd even send a wreath to your funeral.
Hiring a lot of people from his home country (even though there is an IDC) and paying them 20% more than what others were getting.
Microsoft hires some 200-300 college hires internationally ( from outside North America ) . They generally don't hire directly from India because of IDC which has a pretty third rate reputation amongst the top students in India. A lot of the best students in India don't want to waste their time joining IDC ( junk work , crappy pay ). It makes sense to pick them up directly from Redmond . Also it isn't the case that these offers are restricted to people from India . I know of fresh college hires from Eastern Europe , China, US (all over) hired for Bing at even 95k base . The data and search market is competitive. It needs algorithmic knowledge and engineers with a higher IQ to work on than regular enterprise software boxes and UX/UI stuff. It makes sense to pay them more than enterprise software devs otherwise you won't be able to hire a half decent engineer for the role.
Frank Holland put the kibosh on U/10s and A/10s changing jobs inside Operations
Frank Holland. I've had the pleasure to meet Frank in person, once or twice. Hence I can claim that Frank is a cold fish, which explains his affinity with Wal-Mart Boy.
Did you know that when Turner arrived, accompanied by the inevitable reorg, SMSG Readiness (SMSG-R) was going to HR? What a concept, a training org a part of HR? Anyways, doing so would have meant that Frank would have had an org smaller than deemed fit for a Corp VP. So Frank kept SMSG-R, the function of which has nothing whatsoever to do with operations. Ops manages licensing logistics, and that's about it. So it has about as much to do with training as Frank does with the human race.
Enough said.
This blog is depressing. I spent 10 years at MS, having left in 2009. I was L66.
I do *not* make as much money. I do *not* have as grand a title. But, my friends, I have more fun. When I leave work each day, I leave. There is no 'curve', no endless corporate BS, no 'rhythm of the business', none of that. Just making sure we make money.
My advice is to make tracks to somewhere you are happy.
In the meantime I've recieved iOS 4.2.1, 4.3, and 4.3.1 for my ATT 3G iPad. How come Apple is so much better at updating than Microsoft?
Microsoft had to capitulate to the carriers and allow them to test updates. So updates are bogged down and things will likely only get worse as the test matrix increases in size. Meanwhile Apple made a product that was compelling enough that they were in a position to dictate terms to carriers, including update policies.
Microsoft was universally feared and respected in the business world throughout the 80s and 90s. It is pathetic that for all of Microsoft's supposed business acumen and billions in the bank, they now have to beg AT&T to release copy & paste for their mobile OS. The empire has collapsed. No wonder younger people in the industry don't care at all about anything Microsoft says or does.
Aside: Apparently there's already a new minimum hardware spec for WP7 even though it's only been on the market for ~6 months. Does this mean all current handsets are already outdated? (And if not, what's the point of having hardware specs like this?) "Great" move, Microsoft. What's the opposite of delighting customers?
Long-term (15+ year) FTE here who got two A/10s in a row amongst many, many re-org and manager changes (5+) in the past 2 years. My latest manager has put 'underperforming' langage in my MYCD which tells me I am on the list to be fired. Not laid off, fired. This despite meeting committments, positive peer feedback, etc. With every new manager I was clear about my time in level and my intention to carve out a path to success/promotion. Then 3 months later I would get a new manager. Lather, rinse, repeat.
I am talking to Amazon and Google as well as a few other local places. Trying to calculate what our current benefits package is worth as part of a compensation number.
I had no intention of leaving Microsoft until my (new) manager started to be hostile and made the team a toxic and just plain awful place to be. I am saddened that the best choice is for me to leave the company rather than to try to 'fix' things; I used to be such a strong believer in Microsoft. Now I find myself unwilling and unable to defend sketchy management practices and lack of career growth.
We suck. It is most definitely time to move on.
"Frank Holland put the kibosh on U/10s and A/10s changing jobs inside Operations. You're stuck until you dig out of the hole you're in, or you're managed out."
Totally not necessary, as nobody in the company will hire you with a 10%. We're a "one strike and you're out" kinda place these days.
Of course Ops has never really been like working in Tech, it's a different world and culture entirely, so maybe it *was* necessary.
Stupid hiring and retention practices at MS India SMSG have seen attrition going through the roof. we're losing good sales people to competition and partners while our great management hires average sales persons from competition albiet at a level or two above the existing team. Most of the recent hires are going around with a lost "What the f*** am I doing here" look, not able to make the head or tail out of why they're paid so much.
I have been at Microsoft for the last 8 years. I joined right out of college at a low level. Over my first 6 years, I was promoted 4 times. My managers encouraged me to take risks, to be myself, to take on new challenges. I got a 4.0 most years (in the old review system), a 4.5 once and a goldstar once.
During my seventh year, I had a boss from hell. This manager made my life miserable. I worked about 100 hours a week for 6-8 months, hardly sleeping and unhealthy most of the time. I know that life is short, but my greencard application was pending and I tolerated for a little while. Before my boss from hell could ruin my performance review, I fled to another team.
Unfortunately, my old manager spoke with my current manager and labelled me incompetent. I have been under the "incompetence scanner" ever since. No matter how much good work I do, it is the one little mistake I might make which gets pointed out. These days, even if I make no mistake, I get the wag of the finger in an email which points out how wrong I have been.
I know that my days at Microsoft are numbered. My health has worsened with all of this stress and our benefits are not worth this kind of stress. I am not even 30 years old and I have stress-related diseases which people get in their 40s and 50s. I have my greencard now and I do not need to take this anymore.
Although I am good at interviewing and my job skills are up to date, I have never networked outside Microsoft. I spent most of my last two years working hard to please the boss from hell and to ensure I do not make a mistake which my current boss could point out. I know hardly anybody working in another firm.
You guys usually talk about Google or Amazon. However, I would like to work at a smaller firm.
How do you go about networking to find jobs at smaller firms in the Seattle metro region? How do you know where to find the recruiters for those firms? How do you get them to respond to your job applications?
>> It's not about beating Google anymore
Yeah, it's about ripping off Google's search results and passing them off as your own. Good job!
About review system:
At first I though I can explain most promotions as timeQueue.dequeue(), which more or less I can accpet as I understand sometimes it is important to balance. Now I totally have no clude by recent promotions in my team.
As a reasonable person, I understand complain is no use. As a multiple gold star and A20, I begin to lost my excitement working for this company. I like the technology I am working on, but I do get tired of these games. I won't blindly believe google or amazon are better. Maybe get your own company is another option.
Mini: What did you hear at PRISM? Your take on what KevinT / SteveB presented?
The biggest problems with MSFT are not the review system, lack of cohesive development, dysfunctional managers, lack of individual accountability from the CEO down, bloated supporting orgs like finance and HR, complete disregard for quality, complete disregard for customers, lack of strategy - to name a few. The real issue is having a bunch of rich, disconnected and uncontrollable old farts like SteveB running the show.
How can these millionaires/billionaires be controlled? By firing their sorry asses, that's how. But achieving that is a task of which the current Board is incapable. Maybe if the stock gets to $5, which you may think unthinkable but is perfectly possible. The same thing happened to Novell ...
God forbid we have to start using our spare quarters for a Coke Zero when we could just lay off a guy with four kids.
Microsoft should charge its employees for sugary beverages to break even. It would probably save thousands of dollars in health care costs. Maybe even millions.
I used to partake in the beverage program about a dozen times a day. I quit drinking soda for six months and stopped using the elevator, with very little diet or exercise changes and that alone made me drop 40 pounds.
Random question, but don't know the best place to go for information.
If I want to switch teams, when is the best time to do so? Would it be now or immediately after calibration/reviews/etc.?
Thanks.
HR was briefed on the Annual Review updates this past Monday. When are you going to write an article so we can start commenting somewhere about the changes??
So the stock is around $25 today.
Would someone please do something about it!
Ballmer, break up the company! You can't seem to do anything else!
For y'all out there working your butt off for Balmer, see what's in store for ya.
Microsoft screws over an employee who has brain tumor
I haven't seen a post from you in ages, but you should a new one on the following.
http://www.king5.com/news/Microsoft-worker-denied-paid-leave-for-brain-surgery-120323299.html
I am very disgusted.
Microsoft screws over an employee who has brain tumor.
Horrible, but nothing new there. I worked with a very nice person in Denver CO while at MCS in 2000, who was fired the day after she was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis. And in the layoffs in 2009, a person in MCS was let go, despite her having a disabled husband and a special needs child. Good luck with getting health insurance!
Ballmer and his ilk have to go. No really - have to go.
which more or less I can accpet as I understand sometimes it is important to balance. Now I totally have no clude by recent promotions in my team.
As a reasonable person, I understand complain is no use. As a multiple gold star and A20, I begin to lost my excitement working for this company
One suggestion I have is to take some business communication courses so you can learn how to write and speak clearly.
The real issue is having a bunch of rich, disconnected and uncontrollable old farts like SteveB running the show.
+100000000000000
Yep - back in the day bluster "blah blah blah" I've seen this before and this is what we do...
http://www.king5.com/news/local/Microsoft-worker-denied-paid-leave-for-brain-surgery-120323299.html
Yep, this is about the worst thing I have heard the company do to an employee yet. I knew they had changed the disability policies to prevent 'underperformers' from availing themselves of 12 weeks of disability pay. But damn, this is a particularly cruel way to prevent that. Did it never occur to anyone in HR that someone's performance might suffer due to medical reasons? Really?
It's just . . . there are no words. So help me, I pray this makes national headlines and becomes a huge PR nightmare. The company needs to answer for this immoral an unethical policy.
Many of the 10%ers being chased out are senior and principle ICs with 10+ years at MS. It takes way more than 1 year to ramp up to that level of experience and performance.
Stupid. Ridiculously, insanely, stupid.
Of course, this is Steve Ballmer we are talking about. Never the sharpest pencil in the box.
Ballmer is trying to get back to his "happy place" of a company full of people unaware of his "rank and yank" lifestyle.
Maybe he'll cut benefits and increase the dividend to get a few more years of riding a flat stock price out of the Board of Directors.
Wow, Ballmer sends an e-mail saying we're going back to our old review system. We're all going to make more money in our paychecks and get less stock (which wasn't making us any money anyway).
Bold prediction:A third of the commenters here will have to find something new to bitch about.
Ballmer: More Salary?
OP: As much as seeing U/10 ICs move on, I don't see as much attrition at the management level, especially upper management. Take Kin as a colossal failure, but Roz Ho is still around...
This is because, and LisaB/Ballmer know this, that the upper ranks do not give "10%" to 10% of the upper level bands. In fact in the Partner ranks and above, your chance of a "10%" is about 2-4%, which is right in line with more natural attrition. If a Partner is having trouble, they wipe out a divisions complete training budget to pay for an "executive Coach" for the Partner, and let him/her find a new role.
are you fucking serious???
http://www.king5.com/news/local/Cancer-patient-says-Microsoft-cut-his-job-because-he-got-sick-120423754.html
About why your manager suddenly starts to pick faults in your work even though you had a recent stella performance review. Did you notify your manager to interview? Microsoft manager always have the option after receiving notification to use their HR management tool to label you a low performer. It will get them in trouble because the evidence is left as a permanent record, so they will have to do whatever it takes within their networking ability to drive you out of the company, because once you are out, your HR record disappears from the system and it becomes a clean crime with no evidence. Otherwise if someone launches an investigation the manager will be fired for abusing the management tool.
This is probably the most likely reason a manager suddenly starts to ill treat you - documenting every little fault of yours and trying to convince you regardless how well you performed in the past you should leave Microsoft. This is because they have just set themselves up into a situation where it is either your job or their job, so they will do whatever they can to make you leave.
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